Velleity
Dec 20, 2003, 09:38 AM
Hi Gang:
I was home-schooled throughout most of my grade-school years. I want to learn if certain things are acceptable in bringing up to talk about. To be quite honest, I associate "Mind-Brain" with intellectuals. I associate intellectuals with having class. And since I'm not an intellectual, I don't have class.
Is this appropriate for discussion? My other poll doesn't seem to be.
Shawn
Dec 20, 2003, 09:47 AM
hello Velleity,
everyone can be perceived as class-less here. There are only thoughts and thought processes.
Velleity
Dec 20, 2003, 06:13 PM
| QUOTE (Shawn) |
| everyone can be perceived as class-less here. There are only thoughts and thought processes. |
Hi Shawn. This brings to mind some questions. Can social interaction at various degrees of sophistication be associated with having or not having "class"? Like, for example, is there a difference between presenting ideas delicately and pleasantly rather than belligerently? And can this difference draw the line between "class" and "classless" without factoring in wealth?
Shawn
Dec 20, 2003, 07:01 PM
hello Velleity,
I apologize for changing the name of this thread, but something strange happened earlier today, and three threads got deleted (two of them were yours and the other was Steve Lance's), though I was able to replace them, though I wasn't sure about the titles of two of your threads (the other one I called The Ideal Goal of Life). Please let me know if you want me to change the name of your threads. I realize, too, that your two threads were polls, which unfortunately, I wasn't able to recover. If you want, please start new polls and I will do my best to ensure that this doesn't happen again.
In response to your post above, I would say that everything should be understood within the right context and that everyone should be sympathized and/or empathized with. In the case of someone presenting something belligerently vs delicately, the situation must be understood... there are reasons why people present things belligerently vs. delicately. From certain perspectives, people appear neither belligerent nor delicate,... they simply appear. In other words, it is what it is, and they are what they are. Such circularity may be annoying or frustrating, but it points to the fact that divisions such as class vs. class-less, or belligerent vs. delicate, are just our perception, and that such perceptions can easily be changed so that we don't rely on such divisions, or alternatively, so that we see through them or understand things within a wider context and with sympathy. What are notions such as class vs. class-less, or belligerent vs. delicate, but relativistic judgments and subjective interpretation?
Velleity
Dec 20, 2003, 07:22 PM
| QUOTE (Shawn) |
| What are notions such as class vs. class-less, or belligerent vs. delicate, but relativistic judgments and subjective interpretation? |
Shawn, you're right. This is an excellent point and one I entirely overlooked. When I wrote my post, I was thinking only about tone. And tone from my own perspective becomes belligerent when statements are terse, have little content, and use invectives. And you're right, this is still a subjective interpretation. Do you think I should see past the tone, and perhaps ignore it altogether, which will probably allow me to understand the message without bias?
Now, there must be objective ways in qualifying what is being communicated to us without bias. What would you say these ways might be, if there are any?
p.s. Thank you for fixing my post in the other forum where I accidentally posted as a Guest.
p.s.s. The new titles you created are fine. I like them better.
Shawn
Dec 20, 2003, 07:58 PM
| QUOTE |
Do you think I should see past the tone, and perhaps ignore it altogether, which will probably allow me to understand the message without bias.
|
hi Velleity,
from certain perspectives, it's clearly understood that there are reasons for everything and for everyone's behavior, and thus everything's understood within a wider context of the inextricable web of cause and effect. Here, instead of 'reacting' to the person's belligerence, we understand the approprate context and the cause and effect of the situation, and can further sympathize and/or empathize with the individual, even if they've done us 'wrong' (or what other people would call 'wrong'). At this point, you can simply be understanding of the situation, and let it go at that, or you can decide to get indignant and fired up, thereby allowing this aspect of yourself to express itself. What's the better course of action? Of course it's a personal decision. Sometimes anger roused by others can be used productively, and is thereby a good thing, but othertimes it's in our best interest not to be so roused. In both cases, there should always be the completest understanding of what's going on in the situation, in oneself, and the relations between them.
I do not know enough about your situation to give advice as to which of the above actions to take, and to me, they both seem viable options to you. Think about it, and do what you will, with all of your being, as it were.
| QUOTE |
Now, there must be objective ways in qualifying what is being communicated to us without bias. What would you say these ways might be, if there are any?
|
I don't believe in objectivity. I believe in scientific and quantitative observations, but there's always a subjective component. If ever it appears objective, then it's only an illusion due to our relatively limited states of consciousness. This is not derogatory, but I mean it in the sense that we're all human beings with human consciousness. The fact that we all share such consciousness gives rise to the illusion of objectivity when we concur with others regarding quantitative measurements and observations, which we henceforth designate as 'objective'. But it's just an illusion, nonetheless. I don't think this makes scientific truth and objectivity any less valuable, but rather enlarges the context in which we consider such terms, to the extent that we realize they're parts of a larger Truth, of which we occasionally catch but the faintest glimpses of.
Btw, I'm sorry about your polls. Since my last post above, I have found out exactly what the problem was and why the three threads were deleted, and can assure that it won't (or shouldn't) happen again.
rhymer
Dec 21, 2003, 03:06 AM
Hello again Velleity,
Your posts are like a breathe of fresh air; you are so clearly able to convey your thoughts and open in your discussion.
But first, on intellectuality. I just looked it up and got:-
"A person who uses the mind creatively".
In other words, classless, dollarless, raceless etc.
I would call you an intellectual, if only for your posted Polls!
I think the web, whilst being an ideal medium for people to communicate, suffers differently from talking and writing with paper and pencil, simply because it is far harder to get a feel for the other persons intentions and where they are 'coming from'. This is possibly due to the need to type, which for the vast majority of people demands more thinking, thereby distracting from the meat of what they what to say, or at least, the way they may say it. This certainly applies to me.
Shawns' descriptions of attitudes to other peoples posts say it all really.
I do believe that anyone who posts here wants either to declare something they believe worth saying and/or to seek evidence of Truths which may be useful in comprehending this marvellous World in which we live. Understanding is I think my 'Goal' as you ask in your Poll. So much conflict in the world is caused by misunderstanding. But then, when understanding is comprehensive, we still need individuals to act for the benefit of all rather than themselves, so I would have to add 'proper Social objectives' to my list [without defining proper here].
Keep up your good work, and be patient; people need time to gather thoughts on some topics, so quick responses may not be abundant. Advancement is a slow process, but nonetheless worthwhile. As I have pointed out elsewhere, construction
takes a disproportionate amount of time compared with destruction! This does not mean we should stop building skyscrapers, it means we should learn how to make em bend!
All the best, Bill.
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