ok christians, that is what i mean, i need help here.. lol even if bad stuff happens do you all belive in god? i have had sum stuff happen to me, and im scared as helll, bcuz i kinda am thinkin bout maybe god dont even ya no.. be here... ya no?? im scared bcuz i know that is wrong but if he were here he would help me rite??? god i need help lol Roze

Roze,
I am not a Christian, but I do believe in god. Sometimes throughout my life as I lived through abuse, I wondered HOW could GOd let this happen to me. I an NOT one of those people who think god was there watching or helping me spiritually somehow, as I don't think God would have "watched" those things happening to a child, but I do believe in God in any event!

Maybe the answer lies in yourself. Maybe if you feel you need God's help you can seek help from your church, or get involved in a church group. Just an idea, but really, who am I?

Love, Dara

who are you? ur my frend.. Dara..i hope lol well see i used to go to this church group in mossyrock and then they kicked me outa drama and choir bcuz i was living an ungodly life.. look its not my fault i can't be perfect.. lol bu after they kicked me out i was doing worse than before...i started smoking and shit...and all this other stuff. i dont know.. im confused.. Roze.. ps.. wat happened to you? i mean like.. how are you>?Roze

Thanks for asking about me! I am ok, just dealing with a very sick dog that I am fostering. He si malnurished, full of sores...and his bloodwork came back that he is loosing protien still...so now I am very worried :'(

You wrote that you used to be in a church group, buit they kicked you out? HOW RUDE!

Maybe there is anoter group you could join, in a different church? Or, possibly you dont need to join any church...I am VERY bad at religion topics...sorry! I am doing my BEST here at a topic I am uncomfortable with!

Good luck,
Love, Dara

thank you!!! you are helpong truly!!! thanx.. i can try Roze

Maybe I could help here?

I've always considered myself to be religious and spiritual, but that doesn't necessarily mean that I support organised religions, or go to church.

The problem with religious youth groups are that they are often run by people significantly older than the youth, and sometimes parents of some of the youth in the group (like the one I was in). That is when lines get blurred between actually helping and listening, to criticising. The problem as well is the overt Christian emphasis, which does not always take to heart the difficulties of being a teenager and growing up. It therefore becomes judgemental, and those that espouse to be Christians actually treat us the worst. [~Yes, this does come from personal experiences as a teenager~].

HOWEVER, being part of that group and going to church helped me to realise what my spiritual/religious beliefs were/are. Consequently, I don't think there is any harm with attending church, as long as you don't go thinking that the answers will be provided, or just to 'get to heaven'. The answers will come to you THROUGH you.

I like to think that we are inherently all souls/spirits that have choosen to come to Earth to experience the flesh, to experience what it is to be human. Therefore, God isn't around to simply intervene or to chart the progress of our lives. The obstacles are there to aid us develop and grow. I know this is hard to fathom when you are in the situation, but please look at several of the people here - many of us have endured all kinds of abuse throughout our lives, and yet we have conquered. None of us say it is easy, but life is a growing process. God is there as our hope, as our shoulder, as our creator.

So yes, the bad stuff happens, but I believe in God. What would be the point if God intervened each time something bad happened in my life? I would not learn, I would not grow, I would stay static. Does God make bad things happen? No, people make them happen.

Man, I sound like a raving Christian! (LOL!)

no!! lol.. well yea i geuss your right tho... Roze thanx!

Sometimes the question rises to the surface...
Where is your God.... where is he?
After I calm down I say
In you...... or nowhere.
You know the answers, you will find the answers, and I've also been through alot of things,
and yes,
I believe in God- maybe this can be formulated in... i believe in a greater force which makes me believe in myself....

And you know there are times when you scream
THERE IS A GOD!!!!!!!!!!   ;D

Roze.
Im not really following everything in here,
i have a tendendancy to get confused lol .. maybe its the blonde hair i dont know ... te he...

But the jist of what you are saying sounds like whatim going through and have been so if ya ever wanna talk just email me at : skittlethemuffin@aol.com, or AIM me at skittlethemuffin or nowexitinreality,  or you canim me here.. whatever but just know im here and whatnot.

Later, and take care,
Anne

Hello everyone! This is an interesting topic. Much to be debated. You guys threw out some interesting information. When the talk of God comes up, I tend to get a little nervous. I do believe there is a god. That is, a god of my understanding. For me, I don't believe in church and religion as a way to find God, I live day to day, as most everybody else and know that if I just try and believe there is a higher power involved in my heart then thats all I need. Many people are searching for some theory of what "god" is or isn't. I do not believe there is such an explanation. To the god of one's understanding is only necessary to me. Life is full of pain and sorrow and love and joy. Thats the way it is. For me, I stopped blaming god long ago and started taking a look in the mirror at the real problem. Take care all

I believe in God with all my heart, and I feel very close to the Divine Presence always.  The things of the spirit have always seemed more real to me than the things of the material world.  My mind and my heart are absolutely and completely open, to all and to each.  I am extraordinarily curious!  I can sum up my religious beliefs in three words: "God is love."

And I send all my love to all!   Diesen Kuss der ganzen Welt!   :-*

This topic is deep and bringing out some thoughtful responses.
Firstly, I want to say that I have no intention of criticising your beliefs - we each need beliefs and they are necessary. Choose what you comfortable with.  Secondly, I do not claim that my beliefs represent the truth - if you don't like them, ignore them, and perhaps feel sorry for me and what will happen to me when I die.

I was brought up as a Christian, continue to live that way, and think the 'rules' are sensible (as far as fitting into Society is concerned). I have not studied any other religions in anything like the same depth, so don't know what I have missed.
I don't attend Church, except for Births, Marriages and Deaths and I don't believe in God as portrayed by theologists.
I suppose I classify all that I don't understand, or can't comprehend, as works from the 'Hand of God' - like how on earth did life begin, what is the purpose of life, why am I here, what is going to happen in the future?

I also tend to think that it is most likely that religious behaviour and faiths were initiated by an early sociologist (or group of such) that could forsee (quite rightly) that the human race would disappear if the brutish behaviour of our early ancestors continued.

Aggression and greed are gradually being weeded out of the race, but at the rate attained so far, it is going to be a million years before EVERYONE has a decent home and diet and security.

I cannot accept that any GOD would design such a scenario (in His own image?) to weaken his presumably higher intentions for man/woman on planet earth.
You could say that nothing is perfect, and that the greedy ones are 'mistakes'. If this was the case a Godlike designer would have done something about it.

What purpose does man serve on Earth, except for himself or other living creatures?
Worldwide, people are afflicted with poverty, disease, homelessness, starvation, ill-health, inequality, unequal opportunities etc. etc!

Whilst we do have people marching for 'war' or 'no war' at the moment, how often do we go out on the streets and shout about that list of unlikeables above?

NEVER!

We are a selfish race, and whilst some happiness and good living goes on, it seems more likely to me that the world was created by a devil!
As it happens, I don't believe in the devil either!

I know that humans, with their capacity to understand the real  world, solve problems and initiate changes, is capable of ridding everybody of those unnecessary hardships which do prevail (health may be the last).
The Force (and that is what it will take) has yet to arrive amongst us! God come soon!
Best regards, Bill.

All of mankind's thoughts are an utterly insignificant reflection

Hello again asdf,
You may well be right!!
In fact, to go even further, some people believe that the whole of mankind is insignificant, especially in the context of the Universe as we know it.
In a sense I agree with this view, but nonetheless I am glad I am alive, I appreciate the thinking I can undertake and I enjoy pondering the unponderables of life! (and yet I suffer from anhedonia)! Explain that away.

Best regards, Bill.

was it Socrates who said that 'Man is infinitesmally small in the Universe' or something like that?

it can be a fun, but also terrifying, thing to contemplate the fact that Man lies precariously between two spatial infinities; the infinitely large and the infinitely small.  Truly worlds within worlds.  ( Not to mention the temporal infinities of the infinite past and infinite future that he's caught between! )


anhedonia = Not hedonistic?   Is that like asceticism?

haha lol i dont know.. hm.. but see i am getting to where i am totally sure that god exits eright.. but im still csared ya know.. wat if im wrong.. wat if he hates me. wat if he leaves me like veryone esle.. ya know?? soryr i cant spell ROoze*

If all of mankind's thoughts are an utterly insignificant reflection, they would not be worth writing down!

it's all relative.

i.e., 'all of mankind's thoughts are an insignificant reflection RELATIVE to everything that can be thought, which includes the infinity of thoughts utterly beyond the capacity of mankind's infinitesmally small intellect.'

ok not to try to be rude. and not to make ya'll mad... but im believing in god right abuot now.. thinkn about if you read the bible, which is so true.. ya know.. i just i do.. and im srry if i offend anyone by saying im a christion abd then i cus, but it dont say no where that you cant cus, and its a hbbit taht im trying to break.. ROoze*

Hi ASDF,
anhedonia is the inability to enjoy. It has degrees.
asceticism is denial of enjoyment by choice.
These definitions are from 'Babylon' software.


I don't believe in infinity. It is a concept to allow mathematics to function - just as is 'zero'.

I have no clarification yet for infinity, but for 'zero':

3-3=0
3,000-3,000=0

If the numbers are of people, then quite obviously, 3 dead is not the same as 3,000 dead, yet according to maths it is.
Best regards, Bill.

hey look no offence meant or anything but god is real and if you dontlike itl.. imsorry

Hi folks,
Sure ,I believe in God--- because I believe in myself. God gave us free will ! Isn't it wonderful-- I can choose to be Happy or Sad--- lose the fear--- that stops you from believing in God. Bernie.

i dont believe in myself.. i do beilieve in god.. just not me ROozE*

since you are a christian, several questions " did jesus christ begin criticizing god when he encounter some evilness?"  "if jesus christ runs away from evilness , is he still just?"
god created this world have some evilness, why?, because it's god's intent to test the good,like he's son. a just man is truly just if he encounter some evilness and still remain just , if not then he's not truly just.  

it is interesting to note that nobody here is interested in `god``s viewpoint. does he want people to believe in him? is he insecure that he needs some back-up?are you imposing on him by `believing`in him?what value has belief? can you`believe`and remain open-minded?does saying or writing the word `believe`help you to believe?
i would say,on reflection,that `god``s behaviour is beyond belief!

QUOTE

it is interesting to note that nobody here is interested in `god``s viewpoint. does he want people to believe in him? is he insecure that he needs some back-up?are you imposing on him by `believing`in him?what value has belief? can you`believe`and remain open-minded?does saying or writing the word `believe`help you to believe? i would say,on reflection,that `god``s behaviour is beyond belief!

The question has two points, hardly to deal for me:

1. belief

2. God

Belief is below mind-frame, means: beliefs does not WANT to know.

2. GOD is above mind-frame :-) (does not mean much in most cases in general, in mine special too LOL)

That does not answer the question, 'cos my claim simply tries, to refuse this questions - avoidance of problems, where are already enuff to deal with

for yours

n

love

Since the question was an open one, I shall add the viewpoint of a non-believer. I believe Man created God in his own image as a stepping stone in the process of trying to understand the Universe. We are in a position to supplant this kind of belief with a combination of scientific knowledge and philosophy. This does not have to remove beauty and mystery from the world, quite the reverse. I believe that the persistence of belief in God stems from a comfort-factor/safety-net issue - it is not an easy thing to take absolute responsibility for all our actions, however it can be heady to cut the cord and do it!

That said, no disrespect to anyone here; the secret to a peaceful mind is an acceptance of pluralism (to a degree, of course!).

ID

over-generalization is a problem we should try to avoid.  The creation of God by Man can be interpreted as Man's projection of Self onto what he perceives as non-Self.  Of course, this is an illusion since it's all the Self.   On a semi-related note, pluralism and monism just appear to be opposites, but really they are one and the same.  Fortunately, the truth of the matter is beyond such concepts.  

ok.. do you  guys know how many things in the bible are true? and how many tihngs that happened? i mnea come on.. yea maybe god dont do ecaxlty wat you want or when you want it, but yall gota face it.. hes there.

I'm not trying to be too offensive to religious newbies and the religiously naive, but the god of the bible is a pathetically simplistic and utterly laughable belief on the part of man that truly underscores his ancestral apeness.  To be fair, there are a few thought-provoking and high-minded concepts in the bible, like that man is the image of God, but for the most part it's trash, and I in all honestly cannot say that it's better to have read it than to have remained 'untainted' and 'innocent' of its outdated barbaric notions, mind-numbing blandness, unjustified dogmatism, and overall stupidity.   In truth, I think it's better that we go back to paganism and the worship of fire and water spirits (and the like) than to be duped by the bible.  What do others think?

and im not trying to be rude to you but i tihnk ur idea is a load of shit. pardon the language... but wat the hell does fire do for us? it kills people and land and everything, or water? did it create us? dont be stupid i mean all the things in the bible have come true, everything it has said actually happened and it has been around for i dont even know how many years so you cant say someone just rote it to make it look like another religain. whereas they (scientist) actually found things that prove the bioble to be correct, about the land being all flat, they fouind noahs ark, and alot o other stuff, and did you know that genetically we humans could not be created as chance, and we had to have someone actually making us? excuse no offencse meant but i hate it when ou stupid people say God doesnt exist yet, your here arnt you? any one agree with me? or not, im just voicing how i feel. Roze

It's always refreshing to come across anti-religious belief as I think that there is a bland, all-pervasive acceptance of religion without any feeling of balance, certainly in the mass-media. I try not to condemn the beliefs of individuals - faith may be a great source of comfort for many - it's just that these institutions need deconstructing and revealing for what they really are: super-annuated power-webs for control, repression and exploitation of the vulnerable. Faith itself, by definition, proscribes deep inquiry, yet it is rational enquiry (amongst other things) that sets Man apart from his fellow creatures.

I recently saw a TV program speculating on whether there is perhaps a gene that predisposes certain people towards religious beliefs. No conclusions were reached, but the broader philosophical implications for such an idea would be most interesting!

wel i wasnt trying to be rude or anything, but i mena jeez they have proven that we could not be madeby chance bcuz ya know? lol ui mnea its in a book and ill get it and tell you and show you too! ROze

Do I believe in God?
Do I believe in my right arm? Do I believe in my toes? Do I believe in my headache?

Either God is an alive, vibrant experience of being connected with everything. Then God is inside.

Or else s/he is just a dead concept out of "holy" books, designed by the powerhungry to repress and controll the masses by creating fear and guilt.

Hi, I am new here.
Love
Piratjenny

Roze, it is true that SOME things mentioned in the bible have been proved recently by archeologists. It is also true that a prehistorical ship has been found in Armenia. It COULD be Noah´s  arc. Or not. A lot of stuff has not been proved, alot of prophecies did not come true. What you write about genetics is simply not true, unless you live in Salt Lake City....  

At least to me questioning and communicating seems to be so much more beneficial for humanity than taking on blind beliefs.  

QUOTE

At least to me questioning and communicating seems to be so much more beneficial for humanity than taking on blind beliefs. Â

Agreed!  And nicely put  ;)

QUOTE

....  [snip] At least to me questioning and communicating seems to be so much more beneficial for humanity than taking on blind beliefs. Â

As far my observations from own mind and others reveales:  

blind beliefs burden brainwashed believers,
when censors killed communications.

And censors kill communications,
'cos controversy creates communion

- even with brainwashed bordered believers
from another branch of devine drug dealers!

Censors need to kill communications,
'cos competition creates doubt in dumb devils:

Dumb Devils in danger escape from brainwash
of devine dog-god drug dealers and

start to believe in other shit....

they can read right now


n *;-)

:)kidding

actually yea it is true, and it has been proven by the little left hand things in your body, i dont ecpet you to nuderstand bcu i dont either (lol) and im not trying to piss you off but, its true.. and so is god. Rze

No,  are not pissing me off - and if you would in the future that would be part of being on a forum.

I was only wondering because you mention all this heavy metal scientific proof - genetic, geographic, archeological - for the existence of god. I never heard about most of this and when asking about it it is the "little left hand things in my body".... Hu? My liver? My ovary?

I am more interested in what it means to YOU. How does your life change since you belief in god? Do you ever doubt this belief? Is is easier to handle emotions and situations when you believe in god?

I cannot say that I believe in god but I sometimes feel/experience l him/her/it and I would call them existence or eternity or vast space or happiness inside. Having to "believe" would be more of a burden because it is a fixed state and would limit my experience. So I dont have a personalized god and I wonder how it is.
Ciao, take care, PJ

O.K, 150 years ago it was 'scientifically proven' that if you left a bag of grain in a cupboard it would magically generate rats. Further back it was 'scientifically proven' that the world was flat. Don't put too much faith in scientific proof. It is true that certain aspects of genetics are not yet understood. This does not lead me to immediately conclude that God exists, particularly a Christian God. I have also seen in a book shop a book which tells of the 'magical sun power' controlled by both the Ancient Egyptians and the Catholic Church. So "I mean it's in a book and I'll get it and tell you" doesn't really carry a lot of weight. Even if you somehow manage to prove that a god exists, which as far as I think is impossible (feel free to prove me wrong), that doesn't translate to "Christians and the bible are right about everything."

Thats true. Plus - AND I AM NOT TRYING TO PISS YOU OFF, angelroze  :) - I wonder where this hot desire to proove that god exists comes from. If s/he exists, s/he exists. You dont have to proof the rain, you feeeeel it. Others feel it.
I feel it.

But a christian god who is almighty and just and still allowed the Holocaust, the burning of the witches, napalm on Vietnamese children, Dr. Mengele, mass killings in Kambodia, the genocide on the American indians, torture, ongoing killing of girls in India, rape of children, the cruel destruction of Tibetan culture, child abuse, serial killers, famine, injustice, 9/11, bombs on Iraqi children, Pizzaro and Cortez, cruelty against animals, the atombomb on Hiroshima...
If that kind of god existed it would give me the creeps and I would not want it. Love Piratjenny

oh lol i know your not trying to piss me off! and i dont mean for you too!! lol but i mnea its some genetic thing and my g-ma was teaching it( i dont listen) and i didnt really get it all but i gues it proved taht we couldnt have been made by chanec and stuff, but yea sometimes i get all shitted out bcuz i dont know if i belive or not, and if eel horrible, and id ont know.. RIze

Hey, then let´s forget about science. Seanf has said it nicely, science is a matter of fashion, zeitgeist and politics anyway - I am sure your grandma would confirm that the nazis proofed "scientifically" that gypsies and jews are minor beings and a great danger for civilisation. And that germans are the shining peak of evolution. So much for science.

No, I am still much more interested what beliefing in God does for you, as a person. In which way does it chance your life?
Love, Piratjenny

QUOTE

Hey, then let´s forget about science. Seanf has said it nicely, science is a matter of fashion, zeitgeist and politics anyway - I am sure your grandma would confirm that the nazis proofed "scientifically" that gypsies and jews are minor beings and a great danger for civilisation. And that germans are the shining peak of evolution. So much for science. No, I am still much more interested what beliefing in God does for you, as a person. In which way does it chance your life? Love, Piratjenny

Yes,

the question is faszinating: "'what beliefing does for you...?''

As far I have observed my beliefs as well like others, the answer is simple: beliefs help to hide conscious part of mind in darkness.

Therefore beliefs function like medicin for sick people. Lenin diagnostics: '''Religion is Opium for the people'''.

As student, 30 years ago, I asked as provocation - drugged from own beliefs in the values of society and in mysteries of drugs: '''What could be better?'''

Now, getting older, I definetly know the answer: better but being drugged by beliefs mental or by drugs chemical is clear consciousnes.

Means the capacity to enjoy the world in reality. Reality is horrible , no doubt about. Handicapped believers from values of tradition, education, society, handicapped believers from alcohol, drugs, sex- and love-addiction..., brainwashed blind beliefs in the power of money, politics or priestly words of wisdom

like these your read heren0w...

n * ;-)

Angel this is for you, i know that you believe realy strongly in god and that it means an awful lot that we  share your beliefs but from wat ive read in this forum so far you seem to be completely closed minded to wat anyone else has said and have dismissed it without thought.
it was u after all who asked for us to help you come to a descion on your beliefs and since the u hav completely dismissed all non-god point of views.

I myself do not believe that god exists I believe that ever1 is in contrl of themselves and that there is no completely correct belief only ones that are adopted cos they seem better than the one previously believed .

My philosophy is live now cos Fuck knows wats gonna happen later and enjoy urself.

I DONT MEAN ANY OFFENSE ;

I think Angel is young and when you are young it sometimes feels much much better to "believe" something than  to be exposed to all that confusion, cruelty and insecurity inside and outside. And that is totally fine. Just dont hide yourself behind belief and dont let it get into your way. Uniqueness is more precious than words cast in stone. Show your beauty to the world. And then decide if you want to preach to the infidels. Or just have a supergood time. And I probably sound like your Mum or so but what can I do.....  
LOVE, PJ

If you wouldn't be so stuck to the Bible the question wouldn't be about believing yes or no, with Christian dogmatics who preach yes and nihilistic dogmatics who preach no.

There are lots of other cultures where God is perceived by everyone, and the question is not about yes or no, but about how is he. And some perceive him like this, and others like that, and in the end all of them together know more than each of them alone.

In our 'culture' (which is quite primitive in many ways) this discussion doesn't help each of us to learn, but forces each of us to get extreme and know less in the end.

Angelroze: Did your conviction about the existence of God be influenced by this discussion? Does this discussion really matter? Wouldn't it be better to learn to perceive God yourself?

...okay, I wrote this before I read the beginning of this thread. Now I read it and it became clearer to me the problems you had. I would want to remark that those people who punish you for leading and 'ungodly' life don't really know what God demands from us. And if they would be wise they wouldn't have thrown you out but kept you in to stay in touch with them. Also I don't know what these 'ungodly' things would be. If it concerns love and boys than you can forget them, their moral stances worth nothing. Just trust your feelings. Jesus was great in some respects, he said 'love others like you love yourself'. That means if you're masturbating you can also have sex with guys, but the question is not whether it would be allowed or forbidden, the question is whether it's good for you. It all depends on your type of character, and on the guys you know. A bad guy could spoil your life, and not having sex with a good guy could make you sad and spoil it equally. So real good judgment from your part is needed, and you can best find it in your heart. If you can't make head nor tails from what I say you better tell me then you spare me some waste of time.

I l like this input, numinoso, and find it very insightful.

Angelroze, I feel and respect the intensity of your questioning and it draws me to you. But it also frustrates me that this discussion is stuck with "right" or "wrong" and has nothing to do with alive experience...
Pratjenny

well no im not saying wats right and wrong, at leats if i did i didnt mean to, but all im saying is that im beleieving bcuz i want to, not bcuz someon tells me too, and i got kicked out bcuzthe preacher pastor dude thought i was having sex (which i have NEVER done and wont for a long time) and he just like assumed and didnt listen to me, i was having a really hard time and just didnt know wta to belive when i posted this.. you guy s talking has helped me.. really it has.. im sorry if i made anyone mad.. ROze

Belief, I think someone said comes from a shallow part of the mind. This is a common scientific idea, that the amount of the brain used is only 5-10%. The other 90% underdeveloped, overlooked or extremely subtle and possibly unnoticed.
As children our outlook is somewhat open to experience, less polluted by society, cultural values and standards like success being measured by the amount of money you have, the type of clothes you wear and what kind of beer you drink. The breaking apart of humanity in values and ridiculous standards develops a rather biased mind, a mind loaded with ideas that lead people in search of safety, security and happiness.
For the most part God is ignored or filed in a category that will somehow fit into the minds schemes of reality learned from birth by the examples of our parents and theirs before them that drag the same useless system of values that burden us with self worth issues and ego.

So what does belief mean to an overloaded nervous system clouded with lifetimes of dogmatic beliefs rather than enriched with personal experience and joined in union with all of mankind regardless of appearance and capability? How could the Bible be interpreted when it is fear that drives belief in being born defective or in sin only to try and live up to some idea of expectation described by some appointed expert on the subject?
Years of studying the bible and being taught by someone who has misinterpreted its meanings can only perpetuate the illusion of separation between God and man.

I think everyone knows deep inside that there is something that drives us into life and keeps the ball rolling and somehow we know it is aware of us as much as we are aware of it even if we don't understand it.
That doesn't mean we can't understand. There are centuries worth of documents and texts describing the experiences of God by those that have accepted, or learned how to expand awareness and live it. God, if created in the image of man and man created in so many images, some with big breasts and others with a small penis.....OK maybe a big penis, would leave the idea that God comes in many forms.
The idea of God gets kinda screwed up when we try to compare our experiences and then attempt to come to a democratic solution as to the description and reality around God.

Christ described his relationship with God and said I and my Father are ONE. Bhudda claimed oneness and complete Union with all that is, that God was all.
Well they all did actually it's just that the followers of either called their teacher God and set his experience outside of their capabilities and so they worshipped them from a level of lower self worth and the idea that they(Christ and Bhudda) achieved what they could not. This is how religions are formed.

You take the stories written down by their disciples and then pass them around through a democratic process and standard and you get the generic version of God as understood by authority and the best idea for all.

The texts of the Bible were derived from different writings some in Aramaic some in Greek some in Hebrew and so forth and so on. Any one familiar with the generic version of the lords prayer? The one passed around from one generation to another as it was translated and written in the Bible?

The Lords Prayer

Our Father which art in heaven,
Hallowed be thy name.
Thy kingdom come.
Thy will be done in earth,
as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our debts,
as we forgive our debtors.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil:
For thine is the kingdom,
and the power, and the glory, for ever.
Amen.

Here is a recent translation from a friend who studies ancient sacred languages and the original texts of the Bible. This translation is from the Aramaic scripture.


 The Lord ’s Prayer                        

a new translation from the Aramaic

O Absolute Mystery,      
Our birthing Oneness divine!      
Your loving light infuses all form!  
Enkindle in us your infinite Essence;
Let it consume us, re-turn us to Union with You:  
Our flame fueled with yours,      
Creation completes      
As heaven births through earth.  
Nourish us each moment      
with the bread of your breathing Wisdom,  
And unbind us from ghosts of the past      
to embrace the beauty of kinship;  
Let us not forget that You Live through us      
and we through You,      
lest we toil in vanity for the fruits of death:  
For from You flows the glory of the Kingdom,      
heaven enfolding earth,      
eternally returning to Source.
Amyn

There are as many ways to experience and interpret God as there is as many ways for God to present itself.
Only Humans look at surface appearances and take for granted at what ever level of understanding they are at and then nail God to a cross or put God in a box that they can handle with their limited abilities.
I'm not saying this is the case for everyone for some of mankind has risen above the self limiting ideas and beliefs of God and have become enlightened to experience God and unite with God.
We are imbued with every aspect of God as we were created in his/her/its image and Gods abilities. Only our beliefs continue to recreate the realities based on fear, greed and judgment. Gods intent is not to create suffering, that is a human creation but if it takes suffering to push somone into greater understanding of themselves, to push them out of their low self worth and ignorance than suffering becomes a gift rather than a curse. Sure it may seem to be a pain in the ass but if it helps you it could be a welcome pain in the ass. It just depends on your point of reference.

God does exist, it is just a matter of time till the separation and BELIEFS that support separation crumble, to expose what is real and never changes. When the student is ready the teacher will appear. When the student is ready to accept Gods seal and become God then God generously gives everything. There is a painting by Michaelangelo which shows God and man sitting next to each other both with hands outreached towards each other with fingers almost touching. If you look carefully you will notice Gods finger lifted up to touch mans finger, and all man has to do is to lift his finger to touch God. God patiently waits within for ego to collapse and man to lift his finger and join God in union and bliss. It is not by standing below him but by standing with him.