Is the universe, by nature, chaotic or orderly?

Maybe you could call it chaotic orderliness.

I equate the universe with a beehive - at first glance it seems that all the bees are flying and crawling around haphazardly, but in reality each bee has a duty and a goal.

The universe is a reflection. Depending on the point of origin of perception the vision is colored, flavored, influenced by internal programs of beliefs and experiences.
If the mind is laden with past experiences those experiences will influence the interpretation of reality, they will be akin to the ideas that have been built on the foundations of past impressions.
Like watching clouds and seeing shapes that are identifiable the shapes are similar to what you can relate them to. If the cloud looks like a cow it looks like a cow only if you have seen a cow.
When the mind begins to witness the thoughts and ideas as they pass through, then the witnesser becomes the point of reference. It can ask who is this that makes these impressions and interpretations? When it can ask this question it can be objective from a point of greater reference than the subjective mind locked in its finite world of beliefs and boundaries.
The world is both orderly and chaotic and also niether of the two. It is pure perfection and it is seen 6 billion ways in personal interpretation, from heaven to hell, with everything in between. It contains everything and nothing at all.

From the moon it looks like a silent blue sphere, from mars a point of light, from Pluto.......
Like the tree that falls in the forest with no witness does it make a noise?
Early man believed the entire universe orbited the earth. This was a great glimpse into the mind of man that could see that the world revolves around him. In one sense it does. From Ego everything is connected and eminates from the foundation of belief.
Once one surrenders to a greater self they see that everything revolves around that greater self and so on, until all is surrendered to the one central Sun or self and one witnesses themselves in all things both living and not.
The universe is, as long as it is and will be.

Joe,
Thank you once again for your grand edification.  What color are your organs?  Do they mean anything in the grand scheme of things?  If you would just release yourself, you would not go far from home or embarrassments would happen.  Please do not contempate the here and now as the details would just get in the way.  Please go on unless the pain of disclosing some grand plan that lurks in the background is manifesting.  Is it the Kool aid-no that has been used before.  OK, I have released myself and am now free of my ego.  I feel 5/8's of a pound lighter, by god.  Thanks.  Any other instructions?  Don't allow what I say to show how twisted your philosophy may be.  Sit and meditate, do not let me disturb your tranquility.  God will come done and will smight me, for He is your God and not mine.  But I have a surprise for Him, I have my God, who a very strong being and He eats garlic-not caring who cares.  My God claims to be stronger than your God, any wagers?

My first thought is that you have reacted to the words surrender to a greater self and the word you associate as God.
Sorry I'm not responsible for your distate in my words. they are just interpretations of the world that you seem to have in the back of your throat.

The God I speak of is not separate from you it is you. It is what drives you, your greatest and subtlest desires.

The Ego is what creates the distaste and keeps you separate from me. That could lighten your load if you could ever get over yourself.

Joe,

Since the same God is within me that is within you, He tells me that your version of Him is stuck.

QUOTE

Joe, Since the same God is within me that is within you, He tells me that your version of Him is stuck.

So your interpretation is that God is a judgmental God and your God tells you what is wrong with the world and the people in it?

I like mine better. My God that is the same God as yours tells me there is nothing wrong ever. My God also does not tell me when (I can make a choice) to see something wrong as a preferred choice.

Joe

I find myself agreeing with John concerning your incessant prosylezation and shoe-horning of all questions into the framework of your belief system.  YOu seem to have absolutely no interest in dialogue, and would rather spend all day pursuing the agenda of your own philosophy.  You are impossible to talk to.  Its like you are unable to hear anything anyone says without the filter of your own deluded religion.  Yes its religion, not philosophy, not science...just a bunch of dogma.  I don't even read your posts anymore.  It's all the same meaningless spiritual baby-speak over and over again.  You sound like a wild-eyed desert prophet and I am very disturbed by the fact that you are responsible for instructing students.  You can't even concede the possibility of your own errency.  Anyone with that mentality is almost certainly not worth talking to.  I regret being forced to take such a negative tact, I have no desire to converse with someone who is unable to acknowledge the sincerity of my search for truth or deny the falibility of his own.

Tim