Has anyone had any experience of the "religion" of Ascension?
If so, what do you think of that Ishaya lot, and their shperes and attitudes?
I'm not sure what to make of it all, I might be being a bit harsh but it smells a bit like the church of scientology to me.
Full Version: The Art of Ascension
as far as I know, Ascension is the 'heaven on earth' salvation of new-agers. They expect that the year 2012 will bring about a 'frequency shift' of our universe such that humankind will 'evolve' to spiritual beings (a la Lemuria). They believe that they are currently being prepped for this experience via DNA alterations (including lots of extra 'invisible' DNA, no less!). Judging from some things Joey has said, he appears to subscribe to this idea at least partially
8)
8)
Wow, now there are some claims!
I have been trying to find out about it on the net and apart from websites offering courses, there is not much in the way of substance out there.
I did keep coming across this pair: Christopher and Jeannine Marie Jelm. They are barking mad, here are some quotes from things they have written
I have been trying to find out about it on the net and apart from websites offering courses, there is not much in the way of substance out there.
I did keep coming across this pair: Christopher and Jeannine Marie Jelm. They are barking mad, here are some quotes from things they have written
| QUOTE |
| The blanket of fog is clearing further via a third process, namely, through the efforts of Light Workers who are "poking holes" in the fog! During these times, spiritually-aware beings all over the planet are essentially blasting through the fog to bring more Light more quickly and effectively into the physical plane. This process creates "portals" for the Light and permits Higher Self energies to reach deeply and directly down into the physical to actually anchor in more Light...to accelerate the process even further! |
| QUOTE |
| And on the global level, we know that Gaia is moving rapidly and boldly, too! Her "birthing pains" are growing ever stronger and, during the coming times, you will probably be called upon to be of higher service as this divine global, human transformation unfolds....as we "deliver" Gaia and ourselves into a new planetary experience of Heaven on Earth. |
| QUOTE |
| As vibration levels rise, some of us will remain long-term on Mother Earth to fulfill our intended functions, some will transition and work totally in the etheric, while others will go back and forth on a regular basis. Some folks will do their "tour of duty" on Mother Earth, finish their chosen work relatively quickly and then move on to perhaps support some other planetary system. |
The Ishayas Ascension as taught by the Ishaya's is in itself not a religion but a serious of simple mechanical techniques that draw the mind naturally inward to allow anyone to experience more of themself.
Regardless of the beliefs of any person the techniques work naturally and effectively.
Those that use it have experienced, less stress, improved health, deeper rest and better sleep and a centering of themselves which opens them to a deeper awareness and experience of whatever they believe in as their source of Self.
Of course there are those that have learned and not applied themselves and might have a different idea or opinion of how the techniques work. But like anything else, you get out life what you put into it, and what you focus on grows.
You want to expand consciousness the universe aligns with the desire to bring about the necessary ideas and the tools to bring about the results.
You want to focus on the absence of God and the reality of anything more than what you see and hear and the things you focus on will substantiate these beliefs.
The Ishaya's teach that all true teachings point the finger back towards the heart and that by appearances only are there more than one.
All teachings that point towards the heart are essentially the same teaching in different guise.
Ascension is a name that is applied to the teaching but essentially it is the same teaching that has been passed down through time and it has had many names.
The word Ascension is a common name applied to many new age ideas and teachings but the application of the name in this teaching simply means to rise above all of the self defeating thoughts and programs that leave an individual stuck in repetative loops of low self worth, negative repetative thoughts and with the change of thoughts and personal experience of themselves and the world, health and mind returns to peak efficiency.
Perspectives about surroundings change to see the glass half full rather than half empty, to live ones life in praise, gratitude and love.
Outside of the new age thinking of the apocolypse and earth changes predicted in 2012, or the more popular faiths that speak of heaven on earth.
The ideas are symbolic of a time that will come for man to reach new levels of awareness, to unlock the unlimited portential within.
The time is always a projection of some day out  in the future that comes by the advent of some particular outside force or event such as death or the appearance of angels or light workers.
Heaven on earth can be realized, Consciousness of the Self and inner potential can be realized now if one but only turns in a different direction than the one that maintains the same repetative beliefs in limitation.
I like what the Jelms had to say, it represents the rising awareness in humanity that is expanding at an amazing rate. Old belief systems are changing and evolving. The churches of the past cannot maintain the old paradigms that perpetuate the idea that only a few special individuals can experience the "Christ" within or the idea of Sin in its fear based forms.
Consciousness is not separate and humans are linked together regardless of whether humanity is consciously aware of it or not.
Ishaya means for the Christ or for Consciousness and so anyone who is consciously aware or stabilizes the Christ or Self within is an Ishaya.
 Isha (Christ) Buddha, John the Baptist and Shankaracharya who cognized the Ascension techniques 5000 years ago after the decimation of previous civilizations and the loss of the techniques were Ishayas, as were many more that have left markers to the greatness of their civilizations rise and fall in spiritualty and technologies.
The rise and fall in civilization is and will be the representation of the turning towards and the turning away from the strength and unlimited potential that lives within each human being. The division of the Self and Ego is the line of free will that is manifest by the idea that we are separate and the choice to experience that or Union.
Mahadeva Ishaya (Joe)
Regardless of the beliefs of any person the techniques work naturally and effectively.
Those that use it have experienced, less stress, improved health, deeper rest and better sleep and a centering of themselves which opens them to a deeper awareness and experience of whatever they believe in as their source of Self.
Of course there are those that have learned and not applied themselves and might have a different idea or opinion of how the techniques work. But like anything else, you get out life what you put into it, and what you focus on grows.
You want to expand consciousness the universe aligns with the desire to bring about the necessary ideas and the tools to bring about the results.
You want to focus on the absence of God and the reality of anything more than what you see and hear and the things you focus on will substantiate these beliefs.
The Ishaya's teach that all true teachings point the finger back towards the heart and that by appearances only are there more than one.
All teachings that point towards the heart are essentially the same teaching in different guise.
Ascension is a name that is applied to the teaching but essentially it is the same teaching that has been passed down through time and it has had many names.
The word Ascension is a common name applied to many new age ideas and teachings but the application of the name in this teaching simply means to rise above all of the self defeating thoughts and programs that leave an individual stuck in repetative loops of low self worth, negative repetative thoughts and with the change of thoughts and personal experience of themselves and the world, health and mind returns to peak efficiency.
Perspectives about surroundings change to see the glass half full rather than half empty, to live ones life in praise, gratitude and love.
Outside of the new age thinking of the apocolypse and earth changes predicted in 2012, or the more popular faiths that speak of heaven on earth.
The ideas are symbolic of a time that will come for man to reach new levels of awareness, to unlock the unlimited portential within.
The time is always a projection of some day out  in the future that comes by the advent of some particular outside force or event such as death or the appearance of angels or light workers.
Heaven on earth can be realized, Consciousness of the Self and inner potential can be realized now if one but only turns in a different direction than the one that maintains the same repetative beliefs in limitation.
I like what the Jelms had to say, it represents the rising awareness in humanity that is expanding at an amazing rate. Old belief systems are changing and evolving. The churches of the past cannot maintain the old paradigms that perpetuate the idea that only a few special individuals can experience the "Christ" within or the idea of Sin in its fear based forms.
Consciousness is not separate and humans are linked together regardless of whether humanity is consciously aware of it or not.
Ishaya means for the Christ or for Consciousness and so anyone who is consciously aware or stabilizes the Christ or Self within is an Ishaya.
 Isha (Christ) Buddha, John the Baptist and Shankaracharya who cognized the Ascension techniques 5000 years ago after the decimation of previous civilizations and the loss of the techniques were Ishayas, as were many more that have left markers to the greatness of their civilizations rise and fall in spiritualty and technologies.
The rise and fall in civilization is and will be the representation of the turning towards and the turning away from the strength and unlimited potential that lives within each human being. The division of the Self and Ego is the line of free will that is manifest by the idea that we are separate and the choice to experience that or Union.
Mahadeva Ishaya (Joe)
Laz, it looks like you found some real new-agers. Â What you quoted sounds typical of the new-age group in general, they are predominantly female and feminized male left-over 60s children who did too much acid and weed and adopted a hybrid christian+eastern+native american religious system. Â Joey is similar to the new agers because
1) he is a left-over hippy, and thus likely has been heavily influenced by their thinking
2) he subscribes to extreme eastern religious philosophies (which is probably healthier than new-age-ism, IMO)
if you want to study these people, the keyword is lightworker
some websites I am aware of are
www.lightworker.com
www.kryon.com
although there are much more than these.
happy hunting!
8)
1) he is a left-over hippy, and thus likely has been heavily influenced by their thinking
2) he subscribes to extreme eastern religious philosophies (which is probably healthier than new-age-ism, IMO)
if you want to study these people, the keyword is lightworker
some websites I am aware of are
www.lightworker.com
www.kryon.com
although there are much more than these.
happy hunting!
8)
Au contraire mon frere.
Following the interpreters of truth is the same thing as listening to Dan.
Why go any further than the point of origin. If you want to find out seek from the source rather than the ignorant.
Following the interpreters of truth is the same thing as listening to Dan.
Why go any further than the point of origin. If you want to find out seek from the source rather than the ignorant.
Mahadeva, are you able to tell me what the first attitude is, i think its called praise?
I am confused as to the nature of these attitudes within shperes and have not been able to find any info on the detail.
so far i know that:
What is this technique it speaks of, can I give it a go?
I am confused as to the nature of these attitudes within shperes and have not been able to find any info on the detail.
so far i know that:
| QUOTE |
| The Praise Ascension Attitude corrects the fundamental stress of the modern world, that something is wrong with the individual life. This Attitude by itself is sufficient to generate full enlightenment, but because of most individuals' life-long habit of strain and divided minds, more techniques will usually be required to perfect growth. |
What is this technique it speaks of, can I give it a go?
I can recommend, some reading and other websites on the subject or personal communication rather than go into any detail here. There is too much information to give to you on this board.
But what is the nature of the technique? is it a meditation?
The techniques are used in a meditative format, usually 20 minutes three times a day is recommended as a basic minimum.
Sounds like a prescription from a doctor!
So this weekend format of courses; for the 1st sphere there are 4 techniques, what is the format in which they are taught?
It can't be one a day, so they must be short enough and distinct enough to be taught inividually?
So this weekend format of courses; for the 1st sphere there are 4 techniques, what is the format in which they are taught?
It can't be one a day, so they must be short enough and distinct enough to be taught inividually?
The techniques themselves take no time at all to present, the first on Friday evening,(praise).
The second, (gratitude) and the third (Love) on Saturday, and Sunday the Cognition technique.
The friday evening discourse and instruction is about 2-3 hours depending on questions and conversation regarding the technique and the course, includes time using the first technique. Generally the free introductory lectures get the course questions and answers out of the way and so the friday lecture goes pretty quick.
Saturday is usually from 10:00 to about 4:00 as is Sunday, and contains the information regarding the mechanics and changing awareness of consciousness in regards to the use of the techniques. The techniques as they are given include actual time to use, experience and validate proper usage.
Sunday the cognition technique is given and the day is spent in using all of the techniques, (Actual meditation), and it is followed at the end with a short lecture and a period for questions and answers.
The instruction is detailed because the tendency to misinterpret and project ideas into the process is great, people like to make their own assumptions about what is supposed to happen rather than allow for the individual process.
Each person is unique in their internal programs and stress related issues.
Many approach meditation as an escape. To find a place and time to relax in between the daily grind of life.
The Tools of Ascension are used like any other tool and properly used build a foundation that changes the entire experience of life. This is the goal, not to perpetuate the grind and build a temporary oasis amongst the desert of personal stresses and projections. Improperly used the outcome is less than uselful and a waste of time.
So the tools are taught in detail and validated in their use.
It is not wise for any teacher to hand a valuable tool to someone who doesn't know how to use it and leave it at that.
The student may or may not use it correctly and whether he/she could figure it out for themselves it kind of drags out the process and makes it grossly inefficient.
The tradition of any true teaching is in the personal instruction by one who has mastered it themselves to one who is genuinely interested in learning and mastering it as well.
Ascension is a serious tool for serious aspirants looking to expand their awareness and their lives permanently.
Like a prescription it is given as needed to the person with serious consideration and guidance. I never take the teaching lightly and always will direct one towards their highest interest.
The second, (gratitude) and the third (Love) on Saturday, and Sunday the Cognition technique.
The friday evening discourse and instruction is about 2-3 hours depending on questions and conversation regarding the technique and the course, includes time using the first technique. Generally the free introductory lectures get the course questions and answers out of the way and so the friday lecture goes pretty quick.
Saturday is usually from 10:00 to about 4:00 as is Sunday, and contains the information regarding the mechanics and changing awareness of consciousness in regards to the use of the techniques. The techniques as they are given include actual time to use, experience and validate proper usage.
Sunday the cognition technique is given and the day is spent in using all of the techniques, (Actual meditation), and it is followed at the end with a short lecture and a period for questions and answers.
The instruction is detailed because the tendency to misinterpret and project ideas into the process is great, people like to make their own assumptions about what is supposed to happen rather than allow for the individual process.
Each person is unique in their internal programs and stress related issues.
Many approach meditation as an escape. To find a place and time to relax in between the daily grind of life.
The Tools of Ascension are used like any other tool and properly used build a foundation that changes the entire experience of life. This is the goal, not to perpetuate the grind and build a temporary oasis amongst the desert of personal stresses and projections. Improperly used the outcome is less than uselful and a waste of time.
So the tools are taught in detail and validated in their use.
It is not wise for any teacher to hand a valuable tool to someone who doesn't know how to use it and leave it at that.
The student may or may not use it correctly and whether he/she could figure it out for themselves it kind of drags out the process and makes it grossly inefficient.
The tradition of any true teaching is in the personal instruction by one who has mastered it themselves to one who is genuinely interested in learning and mastering it as well.
Ascension is a serious tool for serious aspirants looking to expand their awareness and their lives permanently.
Like a prescription it is given as needed to the person with serious consideration and guidance. I never take the teaching lightly and always will direct one towards their highest interest.
Maha, between your private responses to me and those posted here, I have to say that this all sounds very fishy.
The words enlightenment, openness, and sharing appear to be being replaced by darkness, secret, and private.
I can't see that this is any way to teach anyone, I am seeing more clearly the parallels with scientology, i.e. pay a moderate fee to begin with, to show your serious, then pay more the higher you go, until you've signed over the the deeds to your house, given all your savings, etc. etc. etc.
Using an analogy, this is how I feel you are selling Ascension to me:
Salesman: "Hey sir, look at this new, big, red, shiny, car. It's nice isn't it?"
Average Joe: "Yes, its very nice"
Salesman: "So will you buy it?"
Average Joe: "No. I am interested, but I don't know anything about it!"
Salesman: "I've already told you its big, red, and shiny!"
Average Joe: "Ok, What size engine does it have?"
Salesman: "I can't tell you that sir."
Average Joe: "What mileage does it get?"
Salesman "Sorry, I can't tell you that unless you buy it. Did i tell you how shiny it was?"
Average Joe: "Well what safety features does it have?"
Salesman: "To learn that; you have to buy the car!"
Average Joe: "I see, can you tell me anything else?"
Salesman: "It's very big isn't it sir, and it's a very nice color red. Trust me, once you buy the car you will learn all about it."
Average Joe: "I can't possibly buy this car on the information you have given me, why won't you tell me any more?"
Salesman: "That information is not given out openly to anyone who could misuse it. It is only given to people who are serious about buying the car, and not given out to anyone who has not had the proper instruction, which you will recieve once you buy the car."
Average Joe: "But you're putting me off, Why don't you let the information stand up for itself, let it accept critisism, if it is correct and worthy information there is no need for it to hide!"
Salesman: "I've had enough, you're obviously not willing to devote yourself to this car, you are unworthy of this information, good day sir"
Average Joe: "???"
My mind is still open Maha, but it's closing...
Yesterday i knew nothing about Ascension, today I have an idea of what it's all about, you have given me this idea.
The only way to live freely is to do it Openly and honestly.
The words enlightenment, openness, and sharing appear to be being replaced by darkness, secret, and private.
I can't see that this is any way to teach anyone, I am seeing more clearly the parallels with scientology, i.e. pay a moderate fee to begin with, to show your serious, then pay more the higher you go, until you've signed over the the deeds to your house, given all your savings, etc. etc. etc.
Using an analogy, this is how I feel you are selling Ascension to me:
Salesman: "Hey sir, look at this new, big, red, shiny, car. It's nice isn't it?"
Average Joe: "Yes, its very nice"
Salesman: "So will you buy it?"
Average Joe: "No. I am interested, but I don't know anything about it!"
Salesman: "I've already told you its big, red, and shiny!"
Average Joe: "Ok, What size engine does it have?"
Salesman: "I can't tell you that sir."
Average Joe: "What mileage does it get?"
Salesman "Sorry, I can't tell you that unless you buy it. Did i tell you how shiny it was?"
Average Joe: "Well what safety features does it have?"
Salesman: "To learn that; you have to buy the car!"
Average Joe: "I see, can you tell me anything else?"
Salesman: "It's very big isn't it sir, and it's a very nice color red. Trust me, once you buy the car you will learn all about it."
Average Joe: "I can't possibly buy this car on the information you have given me, why won't you tell me any more?"
Salesman: "That information is not given out openly to anyone who could misuse it. It is only given to people who are serious about buying the car, and not given out to anyone who has not had the proper instruction, which you will recieve once you buy the car."
Average Joe: "But you're putting me off, Why don't you let the information stand up for itself, let it accept critisism, if it is correct and worthy information there is no need for it to hide!"
Salesman: "I've had enough, you're obviously not willing to devote yourself to this car, you are unworthy of this information, good day sir"
Average Joe: "???"
My mind is still open Maha, but it's closing...
Yesterday i knew nothing about Ascension, today I have an idea of what it's all about, you have given me this idea.
The only way to live freely is to do it Openly and honestly.
I have given you all the information you need to find out what Ascension is aside from the techniques. I told you they are given by personal instruction only.
Everything that is in the lecture except for the techniques are in the books that I have described.
Why don't you read up on it and see if it is something you wish to persue.
If this isn't enough and you want instant gratification, buy yourself a nice toy or masturbate they produce very nice feelings and results.
You want to get serious about your Self and your consciousness then use the information I gave you, read the books and go to a free introductory lecture, ask all the questions you want and make up your mind as to what you want to apply yourself to.
Nothing of lasting value is achieved without some effort.
Everything that is in the lecture except for the techniques are in the books that I have described.
Why don't you read up on it and see if it is something you wish to persue.
If this isn't enough and you want instant gratification, buy yourself a nice toy or masturbate they produce very nice feelings and results.
You want to get serious about your Self and your consciousness then use the information I gave you, read the books and go to a free introductory lecture, ask all the questions you want and make up your mind as to what you want to apply yourself to.
Nothing of lasting value is achieved without some effort.
Touch a nerve did I?
I'm not going to find anything worthwhile out until I hand over $300, that seems obvious, and wrong.
Jesus never charged anyone!
Where money is involved the whole stated purpose is negated, enlightenment is not about how much money you can afford to spend.
I'm not going to find anything worthwhile out until I hand over $300, that seems obvious, and wrong.
Jesus never charged anyone!
Where money is involved the whole stated purpose is negated, enlightenment is not about how much money you can afford to spend.
Then there is no problem and this is not for you.
Jesus also turned over the tables of the money changers blasting them for worshiping their money more than God.
Jesus also turned over the tables of the money changers blasting them for worshiping their money more than God.
you need a better closing sermon, Joey. Tithes don't come for free!
I'm not interested in Tithes, only human consciousness.
I support only what one is willing to invest themselves in.
If it is in their consciousness than nothing else matters.
If it is in something to make you feel good then I will sell you something to make you feel good as do many other vendors of the world.
If it is the desire to make everything free then I support the souls search to remain free and to continue life as it is based on free interpretation to choose what is real and not, to judge or not.
Laz has already made his choices as have you.
This is your free will why should I intervene in the choices you make, or what you think?
The kkk and the neo nazis believe everyone should be white. The majority of christian religions believe Jesus was the one and only Son of God.
Laz believes that truth is free and it is. All one need to do is tap into universal truth and if he is too busy trying to fix all the things that are broken then that might keep him from doing that.
I can help him find what he is looking for but he will have to put the idol down to recieve the truth.
IF he would like I will teach him and show him it is not about the money. We will take the money and burn it before the start of the course, but he will still have to give it up before I will teach him.
I don't waste my time casting pearls before swine.
Even if it seems so by talking to you Dan.
I support only what one is willing to invest themselves in.
If it is in their consciousness than nothing else matters.
If it is in something to make you feel good then I will sell you something to make you feel good as do many other vendors of the world.
If it is the desire to make everything free then I support the souls search to remain free and to continue life as it is based on free interpretation to choose what is real and not, to judge or not.
Laz has already made his choices as have you.
This is your free will why should I intervene in the choices you make, or what you think?
The kkk and the neo nazis believe everyone should be white. The majority of christian religions believe Jesus was the one and only Son of God.
Laz believes that truth is free and it is. All one need to do is tap into universal truth and if he is too busy trying to fix all the things that are broken then that might keep him from doing that.
I can help him find what he is looking for but he will have to put the idol down to recieve the truth.
IF he would like I will teach him and show him it is not about the money. We will take the money and burn it before the start of the course, but he will still have to give it up before I will teach him.
I don't waste my time casting pearls before swine.
Even if it seems so by talking to you Dan.
| QUOTE |
| Salesman: "I've had enough, you're obviously not willing to devote yourself to this car, you are unworthy of this information, good day sir" |
Seems my little prediction has come true, is this how an enlightened person deals with others?
| QUOTE |
| if he is too busy trying to fix all the things that are broken then that might keep him from doing that. |
Maha, you presume that you know who i am, what drives me, and what problems i have. You do not. you know nothing about me, you never bothered to find out!
I must admit to being shocked by your responses.
You are only shocked because you think you know something about me, enlightenment and yourself.
There is nothing in life that is shocking. It is all so clearly simple and easy to understand.
There is nothing in life that is shocking. It is all so clearly simple and easy to understand.
| QUOTE |
| I'm not interested in Tithes, only human consciousness. |
does this mean Laz must give his soul to you? Â
| QUOTE |
| I support only what one is willing to invest themselves in. |
you mean when one is willing to invest their money in me  8) Â
| QUOTE |
| Laz has already made his choices as have you. This is your free will why should I intervene in the choices you make, or what you think? |
maybe a better 'koan' for you is
why do I preach?
| QUOTE |
| Laz believes that truth is free and it is. All one need to do is tap into universal truth and if he is too busy trying to fix all the things that are broken then that might keep him from doing that. |
why do you charge money to show people this 'universal truth'? Â perhaps you are exhibiting a universaler truth
| QUOTE |
| I can help him find what he is looking for but he will have to put the idol down to recieve the truth. |
do you mean he must put 300 idols down in your bank account?
| QUOTE |
| IF he would like I will teach him and show him it is not about the money. We will take the money and burn it before the start of the course, but he will still have to give it up before I will teach him. |
Can he give it to me?  In fact, can all of your future disciples give it to me?  It's not about the money, after all, so certainly you won't mind.  And I would really appreciate it  ;D
| QUOTE |
| I don't waste my time casting pearls before swine. Even if it seems so by talking to you Dan. |
ouch!
8)
Yes.
damn I'm good!
8)
8)
 Hmmm..... you know, if I could free people's minds and "expand people's minds and awareness permanently" as you so eloquently put it, I think I could make a living off of donations, or maybe get a job and do it for free, being the good samaritan that I am. Just goes to show you the evil at the heart of mankind.... a man finds a way to enlightenment, and immediately thinks of how he can make some money off it.  ;D
I'm beginning to see how Joe shuts out other people's interfering questions. He just gives a really short and unexplanatory response. "My beliefs will not be questioned by such infidels as yourselves!!"- the typical religious believing refuge.
I'm beginning to see how Joe shuts out other people's interfering questions. He just gives a really short and unexplanatory response. "My beliefs will not be questioned by such infidels as yourselves!!"- the typical religious believing refuge.
We all follow our foundations in truth don't we.
Yours and Laz's seem to be somewhat limited to negativity.
Yours and Laz's seem to be somewhat limited to negativity.
| QUOTE |
| Â I'm beginning to see how Joe shuts out other people's interfering questions. He just gives a really short and unexplanatory response. "My beliefs will not be questioned by such infidels as yourselves!!"- the typical religious believing refuge. |
If you actually read Joe's posts, you'd see that he's pointing to a way, but he can't take responsibility for freeing your mind or expanding your awareness. Only you can take that responsibility, which you've been shirking all the while and instead expending your energies on trying to discredit others when they could have been better spent on trying to realize the truths of what others speak. This is one of the necessary prerequisites to expanding your awareness. There's little point in your continuing to play the role of ignoramus here. Just because you evidently haven't experienced any sort of enlightenment yourself and instead choose to flaunt your narrowmindedness and ignorance, doesn't mean that you should try to discredit or disrespect those that have, since such actions only reflect poorly on yourself, at least to people who know any better.
so, meanhisattva, how long have you worshipped Joey?  He must be 'large' to warrant such devotion  
Careful Dan, you don't want to scare away the potential tithers and lose out on your income.
yeah, right, as if you would actually give the tithes to me
ha!
ha!
I guess then, you are not as good as you claimed you were. >:(
Yeah, yeah. "Only you can take that responsibility, only you can prevent forest fires, blah blah blah." Me and my 300 bucks. Apparently, the choice starts with me and then dives into my wallet. "I want to free my mind and enlighten myself. Wait a minute. I'm broke. Oh well."
Hey, I discredit no one. Questions are all I ask, and knowledge is all I seek. That and a cheeseburger.
(Mmmm..... cheeseburger....)
But I guess since I'm so "narrowminded" and "ignorant" (since you told me so), I should never talk smack about anyone else (since you told me so).
Somebody needs to calm down and lessen their offensive natures before they cause the person to climb a water tower with a sniper rifle. Not it! ;D
Hey, I discredit no one. Questions are all I ask, and knowledge is all I seek. That and a cheeseburger.
(Mmmm..... cheeseburger....)
But I guess since I'm so "narrowminded" and "ignorant" (since you told me so), I should never talk smack about anyone else (since you told me so).
Somebody needs to calm down and lessen their offensive natures before they cause the person to climb a water tower with a sniper rifle. Not it! ;D
so Joey, if I give you the bank routing number and account number, will you begin depositing all this money? :-*
As soon as I find someone who is willing to tithe I'll send it to you.
So send me the back account number.. by the way is there anything in it?
So send me the back account number.. by the way is there anything in it?
I want the money that you say you are willing to burn. You know, the money that you wanted from Laz where you said the significant action was Laz giving it up and not you getting it. So I'm saying you just hand all that money over to me and I'll put it to good use 8)
| QUOTE |
| If you actually read Joe's posts, you'd see that he's pointing to a way, but he can't take responsibility for freeing your mind or expanding your awareness. |
Maha, Joe, Bubba, bodhisattva? You may be pointing to a way, but i'd rather find my own. I have learnt some interesting things from you, and I thank you for that, but I think I've seen your true colors now.
Synchronox was right when he warned us that you were recruiting, he let me find out for myself what it was, and I'm not suprised he got tired of it.
I hold no grudge against you personally, Infact I still quite like you. You are an intelligent, ellequent, and well read person, however you wrap all of this up into the Ascension package, which I realise is definately not for me.
While there are some truths to be had in it for me; as with all belief systems, I do not beleive it is the whole that I am looking for.
I dearly hope that your presence on this board is not merely a recruitment drive for your "business", and I look forward to further posts from yourself on other subjects.
My Mind is free, my Ego is diminishing, My Enlightenment is coming, in its own time and in its own way. I wish you all the best for your continued ascension. :)
When you find the one thing that works for you you will devote everything you have to it. It is the only way it works, you cannot have enlightenment AND
Niether am I a recruiter for Ascension or any other Teaching, but you could call me a fisher of men.
Everyone finds their way to something, but the reality is that all teachings are the same. They absolutely lead to the same thing, the same infinite one.
Some tools work faster than others for certain people.
Ascension worked for me because it was the fastest direct route for me. It has not worked for others because it is a direct path and is not always a comfortable path. The giving up of attachments to fear especially is a big one.
Most want to keep the good feelings and not face any of the bad ones especially the subconscious fears and habits that keep the mind directed in following what feels good. It's a vicious circle, one that takes dedication and one pointed focus to master the Self.
Just as it takes the space shuttle so much energy to escape the earths gravity it does take some effort to break free of habit and ignorance.
Whether many lifetimes of effort or a single lifetime it takes a commitment to achieve the goal.
It also helps to know what you are looking for.
Good luck in you endeavors.
Niether am I a recruiter for Ascension or any other Teaching, but you could call me a fisher of men.
Everyone finds their way to something, but the reality is that all teachings are the same. They absolutely lead to the same thing, the same infinite one.
Some tools work faster than others for certain people.
Ascension worked for me because it was the fastest direct route for me. It has not worked for others because it is a direct path and is not always a comfortable path. The giving up of attachments to fear especially is a big one.
Most want to keep the good feelings and not face any of the bad ones especially the subconscious fears and habits that keep the mind directed in following what feels good. It's a vicious circle, one that takes dedication and one pointed focus to master the Self.
Just as it takes the space shuttle so much energy to escape the earths gravity it does take some effort to break free of habit and ignorance.
Whether many lifetimes of effort or a single lifetime it takes a commitment to achieve the goal.
It also helps to know what you are looking for.
Good luck in you endeavors.
Bwahaha! Oh, that's a good one, Joe. I mean the whole "fisher of men" thing. You sound like Jesus denying that he's recruiting people! Though I guess that's not really a bad thing.
So what's the difference between recruiting and fishing for men? Is fishing more boring? Do you throw your catches back or gut 'em and eat 'em for dinner? ;D
I kind of agree with Laz. I know what I'm looking for, it's knowledge (which is what you're offering) I just don't really think you can supply. You'll probably say that's my fault. Ah well. I can't expect to understand anything, and I accept that.
So what's the difference between recruiting and fishing for men? Is fishing more boring? Do you throw your catches back or gut 'em and eat 'em for dinner? ;D
I kind of agree with Laz. I know what I'm looking for, it's knowledge (which is what you're offering) I just don't really think you can supply. You'll probably say that's my fault. Ah well. I can't expect to understand anything, and I accept that.
| QUOTE |
| I can't expect to understand anything, and I accept that. |
If that was true you would begin to experience what I am talking about.
Once you drop the expectations of your ideas about life then there is room for something greater.
Think laterally rather than linear, to start, or better yet don't think at all.
yes, stop thinking and you will gnow!
(to gnow is to know in a 'gnostic' sort of way. cute, eh?)
8)
(to gnow is to know in a 'gnostic' sort of way. cute, eh?)
8)
Almost too cute. But cute. ;D
Don't think at all..... that's a hard one. Isn't that synonomous with mindless? Or are you just telling me to only believe and not think? If that's it, I'll be schizophrenic in a couple days.
BTW, it's true. I'm accepting I can't know anything, and that I can't take life for granted. I understand there's no way you can trust me, just like there's no way I can trust you. But I haven't really experienced anything other than the ability to be open to things just as you say I would, and without placing belief in things.
I have no expectations for my ideas about life. Why should I? They only way they help me is by enabling me to keep my sanity, so I don't have any expectations for them to do anything.
Think laterally and not linear. Taken literally, I think this statement means "think on a flat plane instead of in a line." I also think that means about as much as beliefs in divine sparks and supreme beings (heavy sarcastic tone). Though I doubt if you explain the statement it will make anymore sense.
I don't want to gnow anything, dammit! ;D
Don't think at all..... that's a hard one. Isn't that synonomous with mindless? Or are you just telling me to only believe and not think? If that's it, I'll be schizophrenic in a couple days.
BTW, it's true. I'm accepting I can't know anything, and that I can't take life for granted. I understand there's no way you can trust me, just like there's no way I can trust you. But I haven't really experienced anything other than the ability to be open to things just as you say I would, and without placing belief in things.
I have no expectations for my ideas about life. Why should I? They only way they help me is by enabling me to keep my sanity, so I don't have any expectations for them to do anything.
Think laterally and not linear. Taken literally, I think this statement means "think on a flat plane instead of in a line." I also think that means about as much as beliefs in divine sparks and supreme beings (heavy sarcastic tone). Though I doubt if you explain the statement it will make anymore sense.
I don't want to gnow anything, dammit! ;D
'think laterally' is a real catchy phrase, makes me want to do everything 'laterally'! :P
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