| Shawn |
Jan 12, 2004, 07:48 PM
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#1
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![]() God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Admin Posts: 1498 Joined: Jan 22, 2003 From: CA Member No.: 9 |
just something to get this board started (this is from http://www.msu.edu/user/hacheema/lecture9.htm ):
Four Objections to Cartesian Dualism • (1) Philosophical Objection: Where does interaction occur? – Two substances must causally interact. But where? – Spatial vs. Nonspatial interaction – Contradiction? -- Dualism both requires that interaction must take place, but denies that mental events occur anywhere. Four Objections cont. • (2) Philosophical Objection: How does interaction occur? – Descartes: ‘animal spirits’ convey mind’s influence to body. – Response: Still leaves same problem. How does nonspatial substance interact with ‘animal spirits’? Material causation: force is exerted. But force is a product of mass + acceleration. But nothing mental has mass and nothing mental is capable of acceleration. Therefore, if dualism is true, interaction appears impossible. Four forms of Cartesian causation • (1) physical-to-mental • (2) mental-to-mental • (3) mental-to-physical • (4) physical-to-physical • We can understand (4), but Descartes (and other dualists) owe us an explanation for each of (1), (2), and (3). Four Objections cont. • (3) Scientific Objection: Occam’s (‘Okham’s) Razor. – All things being equal, the simpler hypothesis should be preferred. • (i) Materialist posits 1 substance (1 type of causation) • (ii) Dualist posits 2 substances (four types of causation) – Dualist can tell us nothing of the internal constitution of mind-stuff, or of different types of causation. Four Objections cont. • (4) Scientific Objection: the Principle of the Conservation of Energy and the ‘causal closure of the empirical world’ The amount of energy in a closed physical system remains constant at all times (energy is neither created nor destroyed). Therefore, there can be no physical events without physical causes. – mental-->physical / physical-->mental = gain and loss of energy. One historical attempt to save dualism: Deny that mental-to-physical causation occurs • Epiphenomenalism |
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| Guest |
Apr 15, 2004, 04:42 AM
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Unregistered |
Hahaha!!! I can't help but call this bluff! Someone with an advanced collegiate degree in physics would never ever explain the results of the double-slit experiment in terms of 'aether' like you just did. What are 'nodes'? Can you tell me the name of at least one physicist who uses the term 'pilot-phase-wave' background? The answer is that physicists and people with advanced degrees in physics don't use that silly terminology. |
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Shawn Four Objections To Cartesian Dualism Jan 12, 2004, 07:48 PM
Charise ok..perhaps I've just leaped right into the fi... Jan 17, 2004, 12:12 PM
purkinje this argument seems to pit Monism against Dualism,... Jan 18, 2004, 12:18 AM
CWUPhilStudent [FONT=Arial][SIZE=1]Or perhaps, it is much likened... Jan 31, 2004, 02:08 PM
rhymer What evidence is there for the immortality of the ... Jan 31, 2004, 02:56 PM
Kip Ingram I can propose a mechanism for "mental->phy... Apr 05, 2004, 11:52 AM
Dan I believe this is referred to as the 'multiver... Apr 05, 2004, 05:25 PM
Guest Actually, not quite. The "multiverse" i... Apr 05, 2004, 07:01 PM
Guest That last post (7:01 pm) was Kip Ingram again, by ... Apr 05, 2004, 07:02 PM
Dan
I guess we could call it a 'multiverse until... Apr 05, 2004, 07:46 PM
Kip Ingram Yeah, "multiverse until observed" seems ... Apr 07, 2004, 07:37 PM
Kip Ingram Also, I don't really like the notion of thinki... Apr 07, 2004, 07:44 PM
Dan although all that stuff sounds very reasonable ins... Apr 07, 2004, 10:23 PM
Kip Ingram Well, the paradigm that we're all familiar wit... Apr 08, 2004, 12:28 PM
Guest Our mind exercises free will by choosing one of th... Apr 08, 2004, 01:14 PM
Guest my notion is that said randomness provides a ... Apr 08, 2004, 01:32 PM
Kip Ingram I certainly wouldn't try to claim credit for h... Apr 08, 2004, 02:32 PM
Guest
I don't blame you for sticking to it. It... Apr 08, 2004, 02:39 PM
Dan
no worries, I've got an M.S. in physics Apr 12, 2004, 03:26 PM
Kip Ingram
Then I'm curious; how do you explain the res... Apr 14, 2004, 07:38 PM
Dan a quantum 'aether', with the nodes spatial... Apr 14, 2004, 08:13 PM
Joesus If he has an advanced Collegiate degree then he ju... Apr 15, 2004, 08:35 AM
Kip Ingram I agree with the last entry; I'd far rather co... Apr 15, 2004, 10:16 AM
Dan the 'pilot' wave is not a real wave, but a... Apr 19, 2004, 04:20 PM
Dan
Hahaha!!! I can't help but call ... Apr 19, 2004, 04:21 PM
Robert the Bruce Solid State Physicists like Dr Don Robbins and Tel... Apr 20, 2004, 05:51 AM
Kip Ingram Well, if the pilot wave isn't real then how do... Apr 20, 2004, 02:25 PM
Dan I'm not saying the pilot wave isn't real, ... Apr 20, 2004, 06:42 PM
Dan
philosophical, schmilosophical. You can say any... Apr 20, 2004, 06:47 PM
Rick This thread started with objections to dualism and... Jul 26, 2004, 09:25 AM
Nebulous Inferno
Nice explanations. To me it seems like epiphenome... Jul 26, 2004, 12:40 PM
Nebulous Inferno To add to my last post:
Pain feels terrible becau... Jul 26, 2004, 01:00 PM
Nebulous Inferno One more short post for me, then I need to run.
A... Jul 26, 2004, 01:32 PM
Rick
This explains the motivation that channels mental... Jul 30, 2004, 10:10 AM
Nebulous Inferno
This explains the motivation that channels mental... Aug 02, 2004, 02:05 PM
Rick
Many brain researchers believe that lower animals... Aug 19, 2004, 03:17 PM
Unknown "Many brain researchers believe that lower an... Aug 19, 2004, 03:22 PM
Rick Thank you for the reference, dear Mr. Unknown. I h... Aug 19, 2004, 03:32 PM
Trip like I do Cosmic Consciousness
--------------------------... Aug 20, 2004, 02:30 AM
Trip like I do In Richard Maurice Bucke's magnum opus, ... Aug 20, 2004, 03:06 AM
Robert the Bruce I was called The Cosmic Kid by the older brother o... Aug 20, 2004, 04:50 AM
Rick I think "Platinus" in the above is a typ... Aug 20, 2004, 07:16 AM![]() ![]() |
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