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post Aug 06, 2010, 05:20 AM
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I like it, I like it!!!! It goes along with the core content of Shawn's argument. This thread is a gem!
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post Aug 06, 2010, 06:09 AM
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QUOTE(code buttons @ Aug 06, 2010, 05:49 AM) *

QUOTE(Hey Hey @ Aug 04, 2010, 07:20 PM) *

I don't know about the future...

Wait a minute, here, Hey Hey! I'm not going to let you burst my bubble just yet! At the Singularity state, our consciousness are in all possible dimensions at once! And then more! You yourself brought this up one time (sometime in the past, of course!)

http://www.tenthdimension.com/medialinks.php
When there is no present (what fraction of a time period would that be?) then there is only past (but passed what if there is no present?). The fact that we 'see' a construct of the universe in our head makes us assume that there is consciousness. That there is an accumulated and manipulated data source in 'realtime' (bear with me) does not prove a consciousness. I am moving toward a no-consciousness position and any singularity would be based on IT whether organic or silicon or other material. Maybe it's back to my 'merely complex reflex action' where complex is even more complex. And I still don't believe in free will either!
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post Aug 07, 2010, 12:31 AM
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Can someone provide strict academic definition of singularity providing very certain reference source.

I got an impression that different people understand different things under that word.
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post Aug 07, 2010, 03:17 AM
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Free Willonium is a liquid or material or a phase of matter made up of particles that are independent of each, act and react when encountered in many unknown ways, is based on the free will of these particles acting in any possible way, completely undeterminate.

This is matter's way of escapng the laws of physics, or the laws of physics escaping themselves. This phase of matter or material is outside of the laws of physics. On earth these particles are humans with their quirky mind, always fighting, confronting, challenging each other, always trying to dominate others through their lifestyles, choices, etc.

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post Aug 10, 2010, 05:10 AM
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QUOTE(Homegamek @ Aug 07, 2010, 12:31 AM) *

Can someone provide strict academic definition of singularity providing very certain reference source.
I got an impression that different people understand different things under that word.

Good question! Go to www.brainmeta.com and click on this link: http://brainmeta.com/forum/index.php?showforum=13
And what's up with the avatar, dude! The picture, although curiously intersting, becomes disturbing after awhile. Let alone as an avatar. Sorry for detour, but, I just had to make the coment at some point.
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post Aug 10, 2010, 05:21 AM
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QUOTE(code buttons @ Aug 10, 2010, 02:10 PM) *

QUOTE(Homegamek @ Aug 07, 2010, 12:31 AM) *

Can someone provide strict academic definition of singularity providing very certain reference source.
I got an impression that different people understand different things under that word.

Good question! Go to www.brainmeta.com and click on this link: http://brainmeta.com/forum/index.php?showforum=13
And what's up with the avatar, dude! The picture, although curiously intersting, becomes disturbing after awhile. Let alone as an avatar. Sorry for detour, but, I just had to make the coment at some point.
Enki in his guise is banned again!
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post Aug 10, 2010, 06:33 PM
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QUOTE(Hey Hey @ Aug 06, 2010, 06:09 AM) *

When there is no present (what fraction of a time period would that be?) then there is only past (but passed what if there is no present?). The fact that we 'see' a construct of the universe in our head makes us assume that there is consciousness. That there is an accumulated and manipulated data source in 'realtime' (bear with me) does not prove a consciousness. I am moving toward a no-consciousness position and any singularity would be based on IT whether organic or silicon or other material. Maybe it's back to my 'merely complex reflex action' where complex is even more complex. And I still don't believe in free will either!

Missing the forest for the tree again, I see!
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post Aug 10, 2010, 10:11 PM
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QUOTE(code buttons @ Aug 11, 2010, 03:33 AM) *

QUOTE(Hey Hey @ Aug 06, 2010, 06:09 AM) *

When there is no present (what fraction of a time period would that be?) then there is only past (but passed what if there is no present?). The fact that we 'see' a construct of the universe in our head makes us assume that there is consciousness. That there is an accumulated and manipulated data source in 'realtime' (bear with me) does not prove a consciousness. I am moving toward a no-consciousness position and any singularity would be based on IT whether organic or silicon or other material. Maybe it's back to my 'merely complex reflex action' where complex is even more complex. And I still don't believe in free will either!

Missing the forest for the tree again, I see!

No, this time i've got a chain saw! wink.gif
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post Aug 24, 2010, 07:37 AM
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QUOTE(old6598 @ Jul 14, 2010, 12:51 AM) *

A possible form of singularity is described on the websites ilovephilosophy (old6598 or nameta9), that deals with the direct changing and manipulation of the mind - brain, and its neural circuits, emotion - memory organizations in order to achieve an Instant Singularity that implies that no scientific knowledge of the mind or brain is needed (or maybe even possible), but just the experience of the new modified brain creates an Instant Singularity.


....


Direct changing and manipulation of the mind ..... PERFECTLY RIGHT. Towards what and how are the questions. Is it towards something beautiful and sensible or towards something indefinable in the name of infinity and hence utterly meaningless to talk about.

Is there an yardstick to declare that someone has achieved the Singularity that is desired. Will it merely be subjective? Or could it also have an objective value measurable by one and all?

What's the process of hoping on to this manipulation of mind. In the thread entitled Singularity of Future, I suggested that it is the ability to believe in the positive, unlimited benevolence of the Universe.

Can I manipulate myself to believe in this Truth that's already half revealed, leaving the rest to my own creativity? Can I be creative in line with what already exists or should it be something somewhere from the blue?

Agreed that it's not an extraordinary intelligence that's required to perceive this truth. However there's no guarantee that mere lies will change my neural networks efficiently. Nor do I agree that logic would be out of place for this new paradigm that's desired.
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post Aug 24, 2010, 09:37 AM
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QUOTE(Hey Hey @ Aug 06, 2010, 07:09 AM) *
... And I still don't believe in free will either!

I suspect you were compelled to say that.
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post Aug 24, 2010, 08:56 PM
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QUOTE(Hey Hey @ Aug 10, 2010, 06:21 AM) *

QUOTE(code buttons @ Aug 10, 2010, 02:10 PM) *

QUOTE(Homegamek @ Aug 07, 2010, 12:31 AM) *

Can someone provide strict academic definition of singularity providing very certain reference source.
I got an impression that different people understand different things under that word.

Good question! Go to www.brainmeta.com and click on this link: http://brainmeta.com/forum/index.php?showforum=13
And what's up with the avatar, dude! The picture, although curiously intersting, becomes disturbing after awhile. Let alone as an avatar. Sorry for detour, but, I just had to make the coment at some point.
Enki in his guise is banned again!



I have a confession to make. I am Enki. I created Enki as my imaginary furry alter ego to one day ruthlessly promote MemTrax on the forum! I am guilty.

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post Aug 25, 2010, 08:37 AM
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No, I am Enki!

: )
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Flex
post Aug 25, 2010, 08:48 AM
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I think we have a little bit of E in us all.
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post Aug 25, 2010, 05:09 PM
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how about toward whatever you want, having an infinite number of ways to do so? sounds beautiful enough to me...although I may think your way of going about it is meaningless to talk about
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post Aug 25, 2010, 07:11 PM
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I'm not sharing/merging/blurring my consciousness (that I don't have anyway) with E, and that's that!
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post Aug 25, 2010, 09:19 PM
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i would say you do and just did
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post Aug 25, 2010, 09:21 PM
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QUOTE(Phi @ Aug 26, 2010, 06:19 AM) *

i would say you do and just did
Only if you believe that you believe in it.
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post Aug 30, 2010, 01:21 AM
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QUOTE(Hey Hey @ Aug 25, 2010, 09:21 PM) *

QUOTE(Phi @ Aug 26, 2010, 06:19 AM) *

i would say you do and just did
Only if you believe that you believe in it.


The experience of time travel is possible and will be done very easily: you just have to simulate the informational relationships between a perceiving mind - brain and its outer environment to create the illusion, or simulation of traveling back or forward in time.

It really boils down to the fact that our present days physics and science is "running on empty" until it embraces the fact that we experience and see and interact only with information, with information relationships, we are an instantaneous mass - energy configuration experiencing sensations and thoughts, we are a constant flow of reactions to actions creating new reactions and actions, an instantaneous interaction.

If a mind is programmed with a set of memories and then its sense organs are fed a series of inputs that correspond to what that mind would perceive as having happened in the past, then it would have traveled in time: any travel in space or time can be simply reduced to a sequence of information elements a mind perceives. Space and Time doesn't exist, only Information exist.

Is that "real" time travel ? Yes it is, even more real then physically "distorting space - time", because the elementary particle is simply the information not some extra level of mediation descriptions through math or physics. Then what is real or not ? what is simulated or not ? no answers, not even relevant.

The future will be manipulated minds - brains, where their neural circuits will be changed, where there will be millions of new sense organs, emotional systems and experiences, memory systems, the minds will be engineered in millions of different ways, and each mind will live in its own universe, a different universe.

The stage of our science - physics has always been with this particular quirk combination of sense organs and memory and brain - mind. Change the stage and you enter new worlds and new science...
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post Aug 30, 2010, 04:26 AM
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Amen!!!... To everything you've said so far, Old59B.
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post Aug 30, 2010, 06:04 AM
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The links between religion and science: the absolutes, the idea that there is some absolute external, non changing, platonic or mathematical reality. My take on it is that there are no absolutes, only interactions, instantaneous, quirk, one time shot interactions that are perceived, decoded, structured, interpreted according to how the perceiving machine - element - item is designed, is set up, is interacting and interacts. According to how reality is designed within the mind of the modified brain - mind: change the design and you change reality.

The era of discovery is over, welcome to the era of invention...
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post Aug 30, 2010, 07:23 AM
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QUOTE(old6598 @ Aug 30, 2010, 06:04 AM) *

The era of discovery is over, welcome to the era of invention...

That's BOLD!
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post Aug 30, 2010, 10:00 AM
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QUOTE(old6598 @ Aug 30, 2010, 10:21 AM) *

QUOTE(Hey Hey @ Aug 25, 2010, 09:21 PM) *

QUOTE(Phi @ Aug 26, 2010, 06:19 AM) *

i would say you do and just did
Only if you believe that you believe in it.


The experience of time travel is possible and will be done very easily: you just have to simulate the informational relationships between a perceiving mind - brain and its outer environment to create the illusion, or simulation of traveling back or forward in time.

It really boils down to the fact that our present days physics and science is "running on empty" until it embraces the fact that we experience and see and interact only with information, with information relationships, we are an instantaneous mass - energy configuration experiencing sensations and thoughts, we are a constant flow of reactions to actions creating new reactions and actions, an instantaneous interaction.

If a mind is programmed with a set of memories and then its sense organs are fed a series of inputs that correspond to what that mind would perceive as having happened in the past, then it would have traveled in time: any travel in space or time can be simply reduced to a sequence of information elements a mind perceives. Space and Time doesn't exist, only Information exist.

Is that "real" time travel ? Yes it is, even more real then physically "distorting space - time", because the elementary particle is simply the information not some extra level of mediation descriptions through math or physics. Then what is real or not ? what is simulated or not ? no answers, not even relevant.

The future will be manipulated minds - brains, where their neural circuits will be changed, where there will be millions of new sense organs, emotional systems and experiences, memory systems, the minds will be engineered in millions of different ways, and each mind will live in its own universe, a different universe.

The stage of our science - physics has always been with this particular quirk combination of sense organs and memory and brain - mind. Change the stage and you enter new worlds and new science...
I think you have made more new rules here based on no evidence. Or do you actually believe that relativity or quantum physics is reality? They are akin to quantitative art - they are made up. The universe does not operate on a relativistic or quantum basis, only our explanation does and that is the image of an illusion, maybe reality but highly probably not. We all know that time is a construct (and an ancient one) to help get us through the day, and little more. Now what our imagination might be able to do, that is the question in this universe of infinite levels of quasi-physicality and wave-particle dualities. Any description of time, space, matter and energy will be a different description in 10 years. The history of science is a good foundation upon which to base any study of science.

As the guard on British Rail used to say half-way through a journey, "All change!" That is, the journey's route is not going to be what you expected it to be and the destination might not even be reached!

That'll be all for now or someone will say I'm rtb's grandfather and shoot me! (You'll need to search the archive to appreciate that pun).
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post Aug 31, 2010, 01:52 AM
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I am not questioning our science: it is right and perfectly adapted and completely correct according to that fixed stage of how our mind - sense organs and logic are hardwired. Change the hardwiring of our minds - brains - sense organs - interactions with reality, then you change science or at least how that mind perceives the new laws of science and physics, or if it can even perceive them.


The hair I am trying to split: this is philosophy - metaphysics, thought experiments.

The way the mind - brain and the sense organs are perfectly tuned and adapted to the earth's environment and the laws of physics is mind boggling. Now to think that we can change the design of the mind - brain and introduce new sense organs, new logics, new neural circuits and emotion - spiritual circuits and any other manipulation you can dream up of, and have this new mind perfectly attuned to the laws of physics, the earth's environment, and especially the interaction amongst similar minds, the laws of interactions (social laws? ), the meanings and free willonium of these interacting minds with the same precision of our natural state is A LONG SHOT.

Agreed, it is way out, hard to imagine, hard to envision. But the meaning of it is that if a set of similarly modified minds could be created and perfectly attuned, could they envision a different universe, a new set of laws of physics ? How far apart from our experience could they get ? Could there be a one to one mapping of their thoughts, concepts, laws, interactions to ours, or could they have many more, even millions of more ? In theory I see no limit, in practice it is a long shot...

Imagine a mind that could touch the equations of string theory, or create those universes within itself and experiment in them, or similar. Imagine a set of minds that are not all the same as the human race is, but all designed differently but interacting, two different minds, no common reality, some common reality, where is the limit ?

Who judges who ? Which mind judges which ? which mind is in the fundamental reality and which is in the "derived" or "simulated or "fake" ? we live in a system where all minds have a very strongly coupled "common reality", so strong that the concept of "laws of physics" appears natural to us; but if the minds are "weakly bound", are there still "laws of physics" ?

And talking about laws of physics, imagine universes having completely different laws of physics, simulating them or creating them in modified minds - brains, so these modified minds can see what happens in new "imagined universes" with new "imagined laws of physics". But then aren't they just as real anyways ? After all, the ultimate elementary particles are just information relationships, interactions, some kind of weird item called mass - energy interacting with itself (and dreaming up alternate universes)...
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post Aug 31, 2010, 06:22 PM
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I for one, can imagine it... Sign me up. CS is an inevitable step in the evolution of the human mind. The question is when, not if. I find it interesting that some find the boundless potential of the mind so impossible to grasp, even in the face of mind-warping snippets of possibilities via chemical-neural interation agents already available to us such as is the case with LSD. Is LSD's effect on the mind not one of the best possible examples of a true chalenge to the commonly accepted notion that reality is nothing more than a mind construct?
Let's start thinking outside the box, for a change. Let's rush to make reality out of our most impossible dreams. It starts with the few brazen ones in us that dare to challenge the constrictions of this commonly accepted language of information we feed one another. Let's go kill Determinism tonight, for example, and go from there! Anybody care to join me?
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post Aug 31, 2010, 10:36 PM
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QUOTE("James S Saint")
Emm.. actually.. no.

Although this is deviating a bit from the topic, all you are actually referring to is the "language of the mind" being different, not any actual physical behaviors of the universe. Of course, to see why it is that every universe must behave exactly as this one takes some education on Rational Metaphysics which is restricted to extremely fundamental logic. And if it is proposed that even fundamental logic is relative, then no proposal concerning anything at all makes any sense since such a proposal would itself be founded on that same logical deduction process.

Logic begins with the acceptance that "what exists cannot also be what doesn't exist" (the "Law of Identity"). Rational Metaphysics begins accepting that as a premise to thought itself concerning anything but then adds that the meaning of existence is "mutual affect". Without mutual affect, there can be no existence at all.

So already, no matter what alternate universe is proposed, they begin to already have common behavior restraints. Changing the definitions of the words being used, does not change the concepts.

Adding that the very definition of "infinite" means "having no end or limit" and "instantaneous" means absolutely no distinction of affectance timing (infinite similarity of time), we can continue.

Dimensionality gets established by the concepts and very definitions of "near" and "far". That which is directly affected, not affecting anything else first, is the maximum "nearness", "adjacency". That which requires the greatest indirectness of affect is the maximum "far-ness", "most distant".

No matter what alternate universe is proposed, there will be a propagation of affect from near to far. Affect means to cause change, thus time is already established because time is merely the relative measure of change. So now we have time as an absolute requirement for any universe to exist and propagation of change or affect as well.

So now no matter what universe is proposed, there WILL be a maximum propagation time for affect because infinity cannot be reached, by definition.

Since affect will have a maximum propagation time, regardless of the universe involved, that value will be what we refer to as "the speed of light in a vacuum". Again, you can change the language, but the concepts are all absolutes.

I could go on to show that indeed, any proposed universe either behaves exactly like this one, or doesn't exist at all.




You are correct: but essentially you are just exposing the limits of the observable universe from our point of view. With our current brain - logic - "language of the mind" - set up, etc. I agree that there is no way at all to perceive an alternate universe with new "laws of physics" that are fundamentally different from ours: what you are saying is that if we want to talk about or describe or have any connection to some alternate universe with our present mind, and hence "universe" (and by this I mean Observer + External Reality), this new universe must have some common properties that our current mind can operate on, can manipulate, can understand and essentially talk about.

From there you obviously have to get back to logic, to a non contradicting universe, with some kind of space - time - interaction - items - distinction of items, etc.

But a modified mind can do away with any kind of logic we embrace: you cannot put limits on "possible minds". You cannot put limits on how far from our current "natural" state these minds, with their imaginary universes, and interactions can get. And most of all you cannot know: have you experienced all the possible combinations of minds - brains - sense organs - neural circuits - bodies and anything else you can imagine ? No way, the number of possibilities are mind boggling. What does an ant experience or a dog ... just saying.

To give you a small glimpse, the number of possible programs a 4 bit microcontroller with 512 bytes of ROM can have is already greater than 10^100, a number having 100 zeros. And that is the smallest possible computing element we have. Extrapolate that to billions of neurons - sense organs - experiences, etc.

The first modified minds will operate within some kind of logic, but from there they can drift away, "evolve" into other "things". Like the "Instant Singularity", the "Technological Singularity", etc.

check out:

http://brainmeta.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=22324

And then simply, we can lie to ourselves, we can pretend to break logic, who cares if it is real or not, reality is based on some kind of "platonism", some kind of faith in the absolute, which generates "GOD" and "Laws of Physics", but we can LIE and PRETEND, nothing is stopping us. And that is just the first baby step. And most of all, the ultimate "ELEMENTARY PARTICLE" is just Information and Information Relationships, maybe what you call "affects", or similar.

When you are dead, what happens to the "absolutes" ? Your life is defined by its edges (in time and space), but outside the edges there is nothing or everything ?

Take, ART or Surrealism: isn't that already a glimpse into odd - alternate universes ?

Anyways all of the above is false, but I can contradict myself...

Agreed, if we even think or talk about these modified minds we are already boxing them into a similar structure as ours is, but the modified minds can think up of create and talk about others and this cycle can go on until they create and experience a mind (and hence alternate universe) that has nothing in common with ours anymore.

The hair I am trying to split: Our mind - brain is the equation for example, and the Laws of Physics and the design of the universe as we see it is the solution, but I want to change the equation and see what new solutions are possible, even if I can see only up to are certain point (probably not more than 3 or 4 baby steps in a sequence of trillions of steps).

Am I fooling myself ? Is there nothing outside what we can conceive with this mind - brain - sense organs - body organization - interaction with matter - reality ? Maybe, but then just LIE to yourself and MAKE BELIEVE and force it to be REAL, who cares.

It kind of reminds me of how more and more Computers and Software are being used to create "Video Games" or Simulations, we are slowly drifting towards artificial worlds anyways, most of all TV is already artificial and we spend alot of time watching it, isn't that already a clue ? But everything of our mind and experience is essentially artificial, all lies of nature, rocks on Mars that are Dead are the only real things and their experience are the only real ones and Reality.
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old6598
post Sep 01, 2010, 04:12 AM
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I am always referencing the coming Technological Singularity and its variants such as Instant Singularities. This may be due in a few years, now imagine the state of these Supermind - computers in a few million or billion years, after accelerating progress, infinite acceleration of scientific and non progress. Infinite progress to other universes.


Two points:

1) Maybe the wording should be there is no limit on possible - minds but especially possible experiences. It is irrelevant if they are bound to some fundamental logic, if it is so, so it be, if logic can be surpassed so it be, this is not the point of my musings and is not a point that can be debated anyways: you would have to be in minds and experience minds that can deal with contradictions of all kinds because they were hardwired like that. Are they "insane" ? You bet, from our view point wildly "insane".


2) Theoretical physics deals with imaginary - alternate universes all the time: many dimensional universes, odd equations referencing odd worlds, all kinds of particles, etc. Theoretical Mathematics can be even more extreme, string theories, M-theories, quantum gravity, the sky is the limit, only our imagination and fantasy is the limit. Feynman diagrams, Virtual particles popping out of nowhere, tachyons, etc.


So imagine a wildly modified brain - mind that can deal with all of this math and all of these worlds through some very advanced and extreme internal simulations: imagine that this mind can perceive and actually live inside any of these insane universe, imagine that it only knows this universe by erasing its memory of our (only really imagined) "real" universe.

So this mind is living in an alternate universe. So it lives in a universe having different "Laws of Physics" from ours. So it is exploring reality in a way we can only dream of. They don't need particle accelerators, they just need good simulations. The only thing we get from particle accelerators and math is Information, Information Relationships, so this is real science, this is 100 % true, while our natural state is the REAL LIE, IS FALSE AND LIMITED, IS MAKE BELIEVE.

We, as a biological entity are so far removed from reality, there are so many levels of interactions, and simulations, and inventions needed for us to be conscience, it is not even funny.

"Any modified simulated reality system is much closer to "reality", is much more real, is much less detached from reality than our natural state as humans. In fact humans are just a combination of matter, a configuration that is the result of 5 billion years of trillions of random chemical experiments playing out on an entire planet. A simulating machine is the result of a few thousand years of technological evolution but nowhere near the scale of natural evolution, nowhere near the complexity and randomness of all the quirk events that brought to the human condition, hence a simulating machine is closer to reality than any "natural" system, is less of a lie and an invention than natural systems.

Simulating machines, new minds either in silicon or brains is actually a trip back towards reality, is actually the discovery of reality and physics and not the other way around, the real simulation is the human mind as nature furnished it. Natural systems are much more detached from reality than any man made simple simulating machine, hence the simulation is closer to reality.

We are a quirk item that is the total result of 5 billion years of evolution of trillions of molecules on an entire planet. How much further from reality can you possibly get ? How much further from the basic apparent laws of physics can you possibly get ?

On an edge, the surface of the earth being an edge between solid and gas, within a very small range of temperatures and conditions, a human needing so many supplemental systems to exist, like food, water, pressure, the right gravity etc. This is so quirky and so improbabile that it is not even a lie! a lie, a total outright lie is more true than nature!

This shows that artificial intelligence is not only wrong, it is not even wrong since it is so far away from a human brain. Not even wrong, not even related.

The system of a mind interacting with reality is equivalent to a system of a delimited piece of matter interacting with another delimited piece of matter. The interaction being a set of events, a number of events and the observing entity being an aggregation within a delimited piece of matter. Now the organization and aggregations and sets of matter and events, the system as a whole can be any of untold number of combinations, the events and sensations, the observing entity can experience any of untold number of experiences. So no combination is any truer than any other, they are all lies, or all false or all true. They all have the same amount of detachment from reality or we can assign a parameter to define how detached according to how complex the delimited matter and interacting matter and set of events are. Humans are a planet large set having 5 billion years of events, hence very detached, very arbitrary, very much a lie compared to a simulated neural network in the ball of meat that is a modified brain.

What reality ? What truth ? What physics ? What is composed of what ultimately ? ALL LIES...

Closer to reality would be inside stars, a plasma since this is much more common in the universe, or inside planets, not on the surface, or in deep space. But our physics is wrong anyways being based on a lie that is the human entity."
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post Sep 01, 2010, 04:16 AM
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Touché!
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post Sep 02, 2010, 02:00 AM
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The importance of "non contradiction" is due to the fact that many are still tied up to the "problem solving" mode of thinking: in order to avoid pain we must carefully follow the rules of engagement with Reality according to the pain/pleasure circuits natural evolution decided to give us. Since a good chunk of the rules of engagement are discovered and applied through Science and Technology, and since these operate according to strict logical rules, we put great importance to logic. Another chunk are the rules of engagement according to other people (social rules) their free wills and "Free Willlonium".

But since most of the basic science has been discovered, most of the really important fundamentals in Mathematics and Physics have been acquired, the importance of the principle of non-contradiction will gradually erode.

How many times can you discover Electricity, or Calculus, or Newton Mechanics, or Relativity, or Quantum Mechanics, or the Wheel, the Car, the Jet Plane or the Microprocessor to name a few ? Once these are discovered scientists are mostly out of work, so to say. So they will engage in Invention, maybe what they are doing with Theoretical Physics and big particle accelerators.

Granted, there is still a lot of new rules to discover and new applications, but the basics have been laid. Biology and Health Care are an exception, but then again this exception eventually engages us into the Modified Minds and Singularities environments.

So Invent all you want, kill the principles of non-contradiction, this will be the science of the future.


ON this phrase "Once these are discovered scientists are mostly out of work, so to say. So they will engage in Invention, maybe what they are doing with Theoretical Physics and big particle accelerators.", this is a subset of the much larger problem of EXCESS CAPACITY and EXCESS WORK AVAILABILITY,
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post Sep 02, 2010, 06:07 AM
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QUOTE(code buttons @ Aug 31, 2010, 07:22 PM) *

Let's rush to make reality out of our most impossible dreams. It starts with the few brazen ones in us that dare to challenge the constrictions of this commonly accepted language of information we feed one another. Let's go kill Determinism tonight, for example, and go from there! Anybody care to join me?


Yeah, I'm there with you. And believe, it's very catchy; I find some of the most quiet individuals actually start to speak when these topics are introduced. Thinking forward is the only way I feel alive
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post Sep 02, 2010, 10:42 AM
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It'll lead nowhere; at least not in the next 50 years. It's too big a leap. If it did happen there'd be an invention to traverse spacetime and reach stars. Or would that just be virtual reality?
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