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| Rick |
Jan 15, 2010, 04:09 PM
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#31
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 5916 Joined: Jul 23, 2004 From: Sunny Southern California Member No.: 3068 |
Well, there's definitely a hierarchy. Just ask any philosopher about the relationship of philosophy to science and ask any scientist about the relationship of science to engineering:
Philosophy Science Engineering The real question, perhaps, is where does art fit into this hierarchy? We also know that artists have their own hierarchy: Architecture Sculpture Painting Ceramics Crafts Maybe we should just declare them all a bunch of snobs and smash down all the hierarchies into universal egalitarianism! |
| Hey Hey |
Jan 15, 2010, 04:14 PM
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#32
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
Well, there's definitely a hierarchy. Just ask any philosopher about the relationship of philosophy to science and ask any scientist about the relationship of science to engineering: Philosophy Science Engineering The real question, perhaps, is where does art fit into this hierarchy? We also know that artists have their own hierarchy: Architecture Sculpture Painting Ceramics Crafts Maybe we should just declare them all a bunch of snobs and smash down all the hierarchies into universal egalitarianism! |
| Lindsay |
Jan 15, 2010, 08:44 PM
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#33
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God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 1723 Joined: Feb 07, 2006 From: Markham, just north of Toronto, Ontario, Canada Member No.: 4838 |
QUOTE Rick @ Jan 16, 2010, 12:09 AM.Well, there's definitely a hierarchy. Just ask any philosopher about the relationship of philosophy to science and ask any scientist about the relationship of science to engineering: "GEE!!! I wonder?" said the philosopher. "Creation is great, but look what happened when GOD took a day off--All that Good, Order and Design... Now nothing but CHAOS. I wonder if we can make something that is good and useful out of it?"... The real question, perhaps, is where does art fit into this hierarchy? ... Maybe we should just declare them all a bunch of snobs and smash down all the hierarchies into universal egalitarianism! "Order? You want Order? OK! We will work on it" said the scientists. "Patiently we will study and experiment to see what it is made of and how it works. Perhaps, eventually, with the help of the engineers and the technologists something useful and good will evolve. What about the artists? Any artists in the house?" "At your service" said the artists. "But if there is to be no more chaos, we will all need to work at it, consciously, cooperatively and artistically. With the materials and tools needed, and with the help of the artisans, we will do all we can to guide all of us to a Design that is Desirable for all of us, and a joy forever." Up spoke the spirit-filled pneumatologists--philosophers and prophets: "G0d--the spark of spirituality in each of us--and GOD--the spark in all creation. This spirit inspires us to realize what created all this chaos: It happened when we abused our free will. For selfish and evil reasons, we became greedy for wealth and power. Instead of serving one another, a few of us chose the way of dictatorship and have others serve us. Most of us became slothful, blind and apathetic. We allowed corrupt politicians, put in power by the equally corrupt business leaders, especially the corrupt bankers--to control us. I warn you: Be aware! Wake up and repent: They did it before and, unless we stay awake, they will do it, again!" BTW, do not confuse wise philosophers and prophets--Socrates, Aristotle, the Hebrew prophets of the Old and New Testaments, the many sages from the east, and the great reformers from the Middle Ages onwards--with the priest-controlled non-democratic cults known as organized religion. Strongly desiring to maintain their own position of privilege and power, the latter usually remain silent, or operate in complete cooperation with the powers that be. |
| Hey Hey |
Jan 15, 2010, 10:10 PM
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#34
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
It's strange how god was designed to resemble a politician - all talk and no action.
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| code buttons |
Jan 15, 2010, 10:55 PM
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#35
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 2450 Joined: Oct 05, 2005 Member No.: 4556 |
Pat Robertson: Haiti 'Cursed' By 'Pact To The Devil' (VIDEO)
Here's a good example of religion's benefits to society for you: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/13/p...e_n_422099.html |
| Lindsay |
Jan 16, 2010, 02:09 PM
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#36
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God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 1723 Joined: Feb 07, 2006 From: Markham, just north of Toronto, Ontario, Canada Member No.: 4838 |
It's strange how god was designed to resemble a politician - all talk and no action. Excellent point, HH. =================== Most of you are aware by now, that I lived out my childhood during the Great Depression--1930-1939. I also saw WW 2, close-up--1939-1945. For me it was a time of poverty and danger. I experienced seeing the death of four members of my family, including a brother, a sister, her entire family, and my parents. War, also, brought death and destruction to my home town (69 young merchant-seamen died in action). I lived under no illusion that there was a god up there answering yes to all our prayers, looking after all our needs and filling all his creation with sweetness and light, all the time. At 15/16 I was a strong skeptic and almost became and atheist. Instead, as a university student I decided, with the help of the arts and sciences to search for a definition of 'god' that made sense to me. Looking back I now realize what theists and atheists have in common: They both think of 'god' as a supernatural being. On page 31 of, The GOD Delusion, Richard Dawkins defines what he calls the God Hypothesis. He writes : there exists a superhuman, supernatural intelligence who deliberately designed and created the universe and everything in it, including us. With the same definition in mind his book advocates an alternative view: Any creative intelligence of sufficient complexity to design anything, comes into existence only as the end product of an extended process of gradual evolution. Having given this definition, he goes on to say: "Creative intelligences [I presume he means us] being evolved, necessarily arrive late in the universe, and therefore cannot be responsible for designing it. God, in the sense defined, is an illusion; and as later chapters will show, a pernicious [destructive, false, deadly] delusion." If I understand what he writes, Richard Dawkins is saying that, theists and atheists both have the same definition of 'god' as a "superhuman and supernatural being". However, here is how they differ: Theists, without any concrete evidence whatsoever, simply believe in and live out their lives based on what they think of as a great truth: God will reward all good and faithful believers and give them eternal and glorious lives in the hereafter. Some theists teach that non believers will simply die. More conservative theists threaten--again with no evidence--that non believers, who refuse to repent, will go to a pain-filled hell. If the theists are right: Believers will be rewarded with eternal life in a beautiful heaven. Not a bad deal. And it has lots of incentive. On the other hand, according to RD, atheism offers very little, or no, reward. Like theists--again without any evidence--atheists are expected to be content to spend the rest of their short lives trying to convince anyone willing to listen to them that they are right and that theists are wrong. The only prize atheism offers is: If you are lucky, you will have a good life and die peacefully. For the many millions who will live miserably and die the same way, the rewards is simply death. Compared with theism, not much of a reward, or incentive here. Are these the only two choices we have, the choice between theism and atheism? IMO, of course not. There is another choice: We can choose to evolve physically, mentally and spiritually to be at one with all that is--at one with GOD--forever. Again no evidence, but it certainly sounds good and rewarding. With this in mind, here is a revision of my last post: SIN HAPPENS WHEN WE CONSCIOUSLY CHOOSE TO DO EVIL TO SELF AND OTHERS. BUT WE ARE FREE TO CHOOSE THE GOOD LIFE Up spoke the spirit-filled--i.e., morally self-aware pneumatologists, philosophers and prophets: "We are not talking about a god as a dimensional being, one who can be designed. Such a god is an idol. We speak of G0d as the spark of moral spirituality, which dwells in each of us and inspires us to take action. We speak of GOD--an acronym, not a noun--as that spark in all creation which draws us take action as we eternally evolve, or unfold into life. This spirit will help us understand what created all this chaos: "It happened when we abused our free will. Foolishly, we used it to choose evil, not the good. For selfish and evil reasons, some of us became greedy for wealth and power. Instead of choosing to serve one another and create a commonwealth, some of us chose the way of power and dictatorship. Foolishly, we thought that there is a shortage of wealth and power and that for us to have any we had to force others to give us theirs and serve us. If we are among those who chose the foolish way of power and greed it is always a good idea to change our minds--to repent. "Most of us, because we lost our power and wealth, also, foolishly assumed that there is a shortage. Because of this we became slothful, blind to the possibilities and apathetic about our opportunities. We buried our talents. And we allowed corrupt politicians, put in power by the equally corrupt business leaders, especially the corrupt bankers--to control us and keep in debt and bondage. If we are in this group now is our opportunity to be aware, to wake up and repent: They did it before and, unless we stay awake, they will do it, again!" BTW, there is a difference between good and bad religions, between good and wise philosophers and prophets and those who are not. Of course there have always been great and self-sacrificing moral leaders like Socrates, Aristotle, the Hebrew and Gentile prophets of the Old and New Testaments, the many sages from the east, the great reformers from the Middle Ages onwards, even to this day. Such have risked, and still risk, their very lives in standing up to the hirelings, clergy and lay, in control of bad, highly organized and non-democratic religions. Strongly desiring to maintain their own position of privilege and power, such corrupt leaders, even now, often remain silent, or openly cooperate with the powers that be. In the face of this, I am sure all good people agree that, "The price of freedom is constant vigilance?" Knowing this then, are we willing to choose to be at one with all that good, orderly and desirable--to support good leaders and have the wisdom and courage to pay the price? |
| Lindsay |
Jan 16, 2010, 10:54 PM
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#37
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God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 1723 Joined: Feb 07, 2006 From: Markham, just north of Toronto, Ontario, Canada Member No.: 4838 |
Pat Robertson: Haiti 'Cursed' By 'Pact To The Devil' (VIDEO) =============================================Here's a good example of religion's benefits to society for you: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/13/p...e_n_422099.html Yes, there are those who give religion a bad name, and all forms of evil ought to be exposed. However, to be morally fair, there are religions, such as the Salvation Army, the Red Cresent (Muslim version of the the Red Cross), World Vision (non-sectarian and religion-inspired), the Unitarians, and religion-inspired secular organizations such as the Red Cross, etc. Of course, I am also proud of the work done by my own United Church of Canada. http://united-church.ca/communications/news/response/100113 "The church has already committed $20,000 to relief efforts by partners in the region." A charity I helped start (1973) and I volunteer with, is the Family Life Foundation (non-sectarian) http://www.flfcanada It will be adding to the support by the churches BTW, all are safe ways to send your support. |
| Trip like I do |
Jan 17, 2010, 10:16 AM
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#38
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 5143 Joined: Aug 11, 2004 From: Earth^2 Member No.: 3202 |
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| Rick |
Jan 18, 2010, 01:30 PM
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#39
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 5916 Joined: Jul 23, 2004 From: Sunny Southern California Member No.: 3068 |
Hey, anything to keep you guessing.
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| Trip like I do |
Jan 18, 2010, 05:04 PM
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#40
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 5143 Joined: Aug 11, 2004 From: Earth^2 Member No.: 3202 |
oh, is that what your doing.... I thought the wagner modernist bastions we're maybe starting to get a little flaky, cracks we're beginning to form, and fissures were beginning to widen, lol!
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| Anthu |
Jan 20, 2010, 05:57 AM
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#41
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
It's easy to manipulate the semantics but the hole of unsubstantiated make-believe dug by religious faith is not so easy to get out of. Of course scientists have faith but it merely means an eagerness to discover or understand, or a (possible temporary) satisfaction with present theories. But scientists know that much of what they 'know' and many theories will be modified and change, as more or better evidence is acquired through the accepted scientific method. Scientists are realists and know that things could change. But they seek the truth and are not so easily fobbed off by fairy stories that debase and demean the human 'spirit' and abilities. As soon as we are able to prevent the brain-washing of children by religions (some of which is clearly and visibly child abuse), eventually we will be able to show our true potential. This is not to say that science and its methods or people are perfect. Far from it. But that doesn't empower the fairies, it just needs sorting as and when. This is a marvelous piece by Hey. I certainly agree that the hole of unsubstantiated make-believe by religious faiths is not so easy to get out of. Not easy at least for commoners. Let me give my take on this in continuation of the Singularity of Future, recently I have dabbled with. The crux of this write-up is that everything depends on the initiative and the creativity of the mind. The end-point solely hinges on this inexhaustively potential skill. It's with the same skill that religions are to be interpreted as well. The bottom line of this realm is definitely not natural science; but the well-developed psychology. The difference between the winner and the loser is the way they interpret the reality in front of them. I don't think I need to explain this in great detail here. The moment we enter this realm, it's not merely the veracity of physical reality; but the enormous task and exercise needed for a sick mind to get rid of its wrong interpretations formulate the new science altogether. Let's deal with religions in the same way too. Once we formulate the rational foundation for the Guiding Spirit behind all manifestations, it alone can act as the prism through which religions need to be freshly looked at. Our dreams are symbolic, we know. A habitual winner will interpret them in one way and the loser in another way. This again reveals the need for the conscious to rise above the unconscious, however difficult and smothering the process might be. Once you are convinced that the search for the unity behind multiplicity is the only genuine one, all the talk of father and son and retorting back to a spirit can only appear as symbolic drama trying to communicate some basic truth. The Quron definitely plays this role. And yet what happens if the christian drama is required to project what might ultimately be fulfilled through one individual who rises to reach the higest growth of the psyche. Again the direct conflict between Upanishads and Buddhism is a much welcome record. Both are definitely required to cleanse each other and they stand in need of further cleansing in the light of today's abundant knowledge. If rightly adopted all such evocative symbols are badly needed to raise our own spirit to the heighest believing mode that what I legitimately desire ought to happen just on its own. Have I taken you safely back to my original theme? My point is that each and every word, incident and fairy tale of religions will have a specific role to play in the ultimate reach of the individual to the cosmic spirit. |
| Rick |
Jan 20, 2010, 11:43 AM
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#42
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 5916 Joined: Jul 23, 2004 From: Sunny Southern California Member No.: 3068 |
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| Anthu |
Jan 20, 2010, 09:24 PM
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#43
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
... everything depends on the initiative and the creativity of the mind. This is the core understanding of Humanism. What is described here is a step above Humanism. Humanists don't require religious texts. I have argued otherwise. If Tom doesn't believe he is eligible for an engineering seat and that he can fairly cross the entrance exam, he wouldn't put his hands into any of these efforts. Objective assesment of his eligibility as well as a minimum of self-confidence in his own abilities are pre-conditions even to make him plunge into the consideration of the thought. Leave alone taking one step. The way one evaluates a situation is certainly prone to multiple view-points, starting from the most optimistic to the worst pessimistic shades. Once this is understood, Cosmic Spirit definitely has the freedom to offer symbols, interventions and even scriptures that possess inherent beauty to display different appropriate meanings at different levels of history. To be frank, I have argued two years back in this very forum that the Spirit has played a deceitful game upon the people. Now I am stating things in a much more positive manner. In the realm of communication, relationship and psychological maturity, it's purely in the nature of things to display multiple of levels of meaning. Mathematical and physical objectivity are certainly important. But in higher realms, multiple dimensions are integral to the very concept of beauty. The laws of determining if a particular story depicts this specific meaning or not will be easily judged by a community of people. So one doesn't have to argue there are no standards here. I got the meaning of BTW just two days back, after I had misinterpreted Code Buttons short reaction to my post. Ridiculously late, no doubt. But this doesn't imply I can coin a new word today and command the world to follow it. So it's obvious there are very clear rules even in the field of interpretation. Had the Spirit not indicated the summit point of evolution, human beings would have been deprived of at least one strong indicator to boost up their confidence in the ultimate riches of Nature. It's only when all things are joined together, the holistic picture and the unassailable faith born of this beauty can reap wonders on the earth. Finally all these arguments are a waste, if they don't push me towards achieving little more than what I have managed until now. |
| Rick |
Jan 21, 2010, 11:11 AM
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#44
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 5916 Joined: Jul 23, 2004 From: Sunny Southern California Member No.: 3068 |
So which religious texts do the super-humanists require? All of them? Parts of the Bible are just plain wrong, you know.
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| Anthu |
Jan 21, 2010, 01:59 PM
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#45
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
So which religious texts do the super-humanists require? All of them? Parts of the Bible are just plain wrong, you know. Whichever parts are plain wrong, we super-humanists would definitely state them to be so, along with Rick, the humanist. Whichever parts are helpful, supportive, inspiring and reaffirming our own rational sense of the Spirit, we will definitely feel free to quote and meditate upon. Whatever is indicative of a pre-existing super design culminating in the divine invitation to human beings to climb up to the summit of evolution, we would definitely heed and appreciate. The rock bottom is our own rational foundation. Any form of interpretation would be subject to this prism. |
| Rick |
Jan 21, 2010, 02:37 PM
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#46
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 5916 Joined: Jul 23, 2004 From: Sunny Southern California Member No.: 3068 |
Sounds like we agree. I like reason. And I feel free to pick and choose the parts of religious texts that I like. And when Jesus spoke wrongly, I will say so. His 'only through me' assertion, for instance.
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| Hey Hey |
Jan 21, 2010, 03:51 PM
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#47
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
Whatever is indicative of a pre-existing super design culminating in the divine invitation to human beings to climb up to the summit of evolution, we would definitely heed and appreciate. What is 'the summit of evolution'?The rock bottom is our own rational foundation. Any form of interpretation would be subject to this prism. |
| Lindsay |
Jan 21, 2010, 06:58 PM
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#48
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God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 1723 Joined: Feb 07, 2006 From: Markham, just north of Toronto, Ontario, Canada Member No.: 4838 |
... Parts of the Bible are just plain wrong, you know. I agree. As an active minister, every now and then, to educate my congregation as the nature of the Bible and as part of the church service I read passages like as follows: Psalm 137:7-8 (New Living Translation) 7 O Lord, remember what the Edomites did on the day the armies of Babylon captured Jerusalem. "Destroy it!" they yelled. "Level it to the ground!" 8 O Babylon, you will be destroyed. Happy is the one who pays you back for what you have done to us. ================================ This is just one of a number of what are called: the cursing psalms. For example, see Psalm 69. There are others. Another example is Deuteronomy 20, which is about war. Verses 10-20 are especially brutal. When I read and gave an exposition on such passages I always added: This not the word of GOD, but from us. Most of the New Testament is much more positive. ==================== BTW, for any Bible passage in a number of translations: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?searc...7-8&version=NLT |
| Anthu |
Jan 22, 2010, 04:57 AM
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#49
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
Whatever is indicative of a pre-existing super design culminating in the divine invitation to human beings to climb up to the summit of evolution, we would definitely heed and appreciate. What is 'the summit of evolution'?The rock bottom is our own rational foundation. Any form of interpretation would be subject to this prism. Think of neuroscience experiments such as associating a red signal with a mild electric shock performed on subjects over a period of time and attempting to remove the bad memory through displaying the signal alone without any more shock for equally the same number of time later. We know that the mind requires such strong signals and repetition of experience before it gets conditioned to a specific way of thinking, feeling, believing and reacting. Any human being who repeatedly impacts his own mind with sufficient reasoning and awareness processes simply believing in the Truth that Nature will offer whatever he appropriately desires will finally see that these miracles begin to happen. Over and above the habitual thinking process that human beings are very well accustomed to by now, a habitual believing process will turn out to be yet another specification of human mind. It is this stage that I have called the Summit of Evolution. |
| Anthu |
Jan 22, 2010, 05:17 AM
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#50
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
... Parts of the Bible are just plain wrong, you know. I agree. As an active minister, every now and then, to educate my congregation as the nature of the Bible and as part of the church service I read passages like as follows: One definitely needs to get out of such compulsive readings which are blatant revenge and vendetta. The interpretation of relying on divine help in moments of adversity certainly exists even for such texts. But any system that forces me to read them again and again is indeed repugnant. |
| Anthu |
Jan 22, 2010, 05:27 AM
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#51
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
Sounds like we agree. I like reason. And I feel free to pick and choose the parts of religious texts that I like. And when Jesus spoke wrongly, I will say so. His 'only through me' assertion, for instance. You caught the bull by its horns. But when you strike at the root of the only son of God, what else would be left back in christianity? Until this drama is fulfilled in another way, through someone who manages to reach the summit of psychic evolution and clearly lays out the path to all others as well, Christianity can never be redeemed. |
| Hey Hey |
Jan 22, 2010, 07:09 AM
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#52
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
Whatever is indicative of a pre-existing super design culminating in the divine invitation to human beings to climb up to the summit of evolution, we would definitely heed and appreciate. What is 'the summit of evolution'?The rock bottom is our own rational foundation. Any form of interpretation would be subject to this prism. Think of neuroscience experiments such as associating a red signal with a mild electric shock performed on subjects over a period of time and attempting to remove the bad memory through displaying the signal alone without any more shock for equally the same number of time later. We know that the mind requires such strong signals and repetition of experience before it gets conditioned to a specific way of thinking, feeling, believing and reacting. Any human being who repeatedly impacts his own mind with sufficient reasoning and awareness processes simply believing in the Truth that Nature will offer whatever he appropriately desires will finally see that these miracles begin to happen. Over and above the habitual thinking process that human beings are very well accustomed to by now, a habitual believing process will turn out to be yet another specification of human mind. It is this stage that I have called the Summit of Evolution. |
| Anthu |
Jan 22, 2010, 10:15 AM
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#53
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
QUOTE 'Summit' implies 'the highest point', implies the evolutionary climax. Yet your explanation '..yet another specification of human mind' suggests that layer upon layer upon layer of processes - that is endless/limitless abilities - could be possible. The two are incompatible, surely? I believe that without a technological input, the human mind has severe limitations and its 'summit' could be close. However, I do believe that technological advances could provide boundless abilities. In the meantime there is a great possibility of human self destruction due to the very nature of the human psyche that has arisen through evolutionary selection. This latter characteristic will have to be engineered subtly in order to achieve a sustainable and peaceful humankind. In the midst of this, there is the possibility to utilise technological means for the purposes of achieving a consciousness singularity (of which there are infinite variations). And a CS might help smooth the road to nirvana, though I can imagine all types of problems with a CS, not least singularity terrorists who would wish to maintain separate consciousness, and also those who would have a democratic right not to be part of a CS for whatever reason. Evolution is continuous as well as crossing epochal stages time to time. The last big leap was definitely the achievement of the rational mind.It is this ability that has brought us to what we are in 2010. The next leap will be a summit in the sense it would imply fullest integration of the individual with the whole. It would also imply the highest power for the human being. That summit stage itself can keep growing without limits. In fact, the dangers imminent due to the partial rationality we enjoy right now, as you have pointed out in your post, can only be avoided with passing on to the next stage of integration. What's fundamentally required is holistic vision and sense of maturity. Chips and technologies would be of little help here. When there's a promise of unlimited power for merely believing it to be so and when there's no demand even to raise the little finger or tighten a bit of muscle, who would ever think of anything else? Consciousness has its own law of growth. If you simply keep believing, believing becomes easier and easier. Even if one scientific soul manages to succeed on this and manifests it to others, the believing capacity of the whole world would instantly change. Such is the power of intelligence and acceptance of a truth. |
| Hey Hey |
Jan 22, 2010, 10:36 AM
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#54
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
QUOTE 'Summit' implies 'the highest point', implies the evolutionary climax. Yet your explanation '..yet another specification of human mind' suggests that layer upon layer upon layer of processes - that is endless/limitless abilities - could be possible. The two are incompatible, surely? I believe that without a technological input, the human mind has severe limitations and its 'summit' could be close. However, I do believe that technological advances could provide boundless abilities. In the meantime there is a great possibility of human self destruction due to the very nature of the human psyche that has arisen through evolutionary selection. This latter characteristic will have to be engineered subtly in order to achieve a sustainable and peaceful humankind. In the midst of this, there is the possibility to utilise technological means for the purposes of achieving a consciousness singularity (of which there are infinite variations). And a CS might help smooth the road to nirvana, though I can imagine all types of problems with a CS, not least singularity terrorists who would wish to maintain separate consciousness, and also those who would have a democratic right not to be part of a CS for whatever reason. Evolution is continuous as well as crossing epochal stages time to time. The last big leap was definitely the achievement of the rational mind.It is this ability that has brought us to what we are in 2010. The next leap will be a summit in the sense it would imply fullest integration of the individual with the whole. It would also imply the highest power for the human being. That summit stage itself can keep growing without limits. In fact, the dangers imminent due to the partial rationality we enjoy right now, as you have pointed out in your post, can only be avoided with passing on to the next stage of integration. What's fundamentally required is holistic vision and sense of maturity. Chips and technologies would be of little help here. When there's a promise of unlimited power for merely believing it to be so and when there's no demand even to raise the little finger or tighten a bit of muscle, who would ever think of anything else? Consciousness has its own law of growth. If you simply keep believing, believing becomes easier and easier. Even if one scientific soul manages to succeed on this and manifests it to others, the believing capacity of the whole world would instantly change. Such is the power of intelligence and acceptance of a truth. |
| Hey Hey |
Jan 22, 2010, 10:41 AM
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#55
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
What's fundamentally required is holistic vision and sense of maturity. Chips and technologies would be of little help here. Chips are but one technology. Another important technology is pharmaceuticals, as pharmacological manipulation of brain activity is highly likely in the (near) future. (for e.g. cf ritalin usage for improving cognitive performance). |
| Hey Hey |
Jan 22, 2010, 10:45 AM
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#56
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
When there's a promise of unlimited power for merely believing it to be so and when there's no demand even to raise the little finger or tighten a bit of muscle, who would ever think of anything else? The power of positive thinking. The Secret, eh? http://www.thesecret.tv/Consciousness has its own law of growth. If you simply keep believing, believing becomes easier and easier. Even if one scientific soul manages to succeed on this and manifests it to others, the believing capacity of the whole world would instantly change. Such is the power of intelligence and acceptance of a truth. |
| code buttons |
Jan 22, 2010, 02:05 PM
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#57
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 2450 Joined: Oct 05, 2005 Member No.: 4556 |
There's something fishy about "the secret" in your website. |
| Hey Hey |
Jan 22, 2010, 02:09 PM
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#58
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![]() Supreme God ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 7763 Joined: Dec 31, 2003 Member No.: 845 |
There's something fishy about "the secret" in your website. |
| Anthu |
Jan 22, 2010, 09:25 PM
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#59
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
What's fundamentally required is holistic vision and sense of maturity. Chips and technologies would be of little help here. Chips are but one technology. Another important technology is pharmaceuticals, as pharmacological manipulation of brain activity is highly likely in the (near) future. (for e.g. cf ritalin usage for improving cognitive performance).The physical stratum and the conscious stratum are both valid here. Your hope is on influencing the physical one, mine is on the conscious one. My contention is that greater influence will arise only through proper understanding and application of the conscious stratum. |
| Anthu |
Jan 22, 2010, 09:33 PM
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#60
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Newbie ![]() Group: Basic Member Posts: 33 Joined: Jan 18, 2010 Member No.: 32589 |
We want to drive clear of any secretive, inexplicable element. The natural law of consciousness, which simply means impacting the mind through proper understanding and repetitive focusing, the result of which gets evident to the one who practices the exercise is all that we depend upon |
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