No more sleep, through neuroscience Options

[Hudzon]

Here's an idea that I've got, and don't mind my wording being off as it's being posted after another all nighter.

We don't know why we need to sleep, but we generally agree that it's because of something that is going on within the brain when we do, and not going on within the brain when we don't.

So, what if we force these processes to occur while we're awake, for example by electronically stimulate the areas of the brain that are more active during sleep?

Would that produce any affect at all?

[Hudzon]

To make humans not require sleep requires a change in the entire structure of the mind and the body.

Which is the exact intention of this post, and as I assumed, this board.

Maximus, your reply is vague at best nor are you giving exact figures to back up your claims;

Please specify what parts of the body are "regenerating" and "healing" and what the two terms even mean.

Or why we need REM, what exactly it does that makes it important and why will we die when we lack it?

Or what are the maintenance tasks that are going on while we're unconscious.

I'm sorry, but you misunderstand the intention of my post. I didn't ask "why sleep is important". I asked "how do we replicate the processes that make sleep important while we're awake".

There's a difference.

Going without sleep for too long actually results in death. I forget the world record for going without sleep but its reasonably long.

11 days for a human.
As far as I'm informed, rats die within two weeks after being artificially prevented from getting REM. No human death has ever been recorded as a direct result of lack of sleep.

[maximus242]

To make humans not require sleep requires a change in the entire structure of the mind and the body.

Which is the exact intention of this post, and as I assumed, this board.

Maximus, your reply is vague at best nor are you giving exact figures to back up your claims;

Please specify what parts of the body are "regenerating" and "healing" and what the two terms even mean.

Or why we need REM, what exactly it does that makes it important and why will we die when we lack it?

Or what are the maintenance tasks that are going on while we're unconscious.

I'm sorry, but you misunderstand the intention of my post. I didn't ask "why sleep is important". I asked "how do we replicate the processes that make sleep important while we're awake".

There's a difference.

Going without sleep for too long actually results in death. I forget the world record for going without sleep but its reasonably long.

11 days for a human.
As far as I'm informed, rats die within two weeks after being artificially prevented from getting REM. No human death has ever been recorded as a direct result of lack of sleep.

My post may have been a little vague given that we have had lengthy discussions about it before and I was half asleep when I answered your question.

I am not making up some voodoo witch doctor pseudo theory about sleep, your body regenerates when your sleeping. What I mean your body goes about cellular regeneration.

Sleep also relieves stress on the body, your bones are carrying a great deal of weight, when you are sleeping this gives your bones a chance to expand again. Your bones expand and contract throughout the day, when they are in a state of constant contraction, this causes arthritis.

Sleep is also used for neurological processing. Much of the free time the sub-conscious has while sleeping is used to process and analyze information. In fact many great inventors including Leonardo Da Vinci were record taking naps after spending a great deal of time working on a problem, only to find the solution upon awakening from sleep.
The processing power of the sub-conscious mind dwarfs the conscious mind. The conscious mind exists for awareness and decision making, like a general leading an army, the sub-conscious is like the army.

I am a bit groggy today or else I might try to remember where I read those REM sleep studies, the results were very fascinating. You have to understand that I read thousands of different scientific studies over the years and remembering where i've read each and every one of them is not likely. I am like a giant storehouse of information, sometimes I even forget I read about something until someone asks me a question related to it.

I perfectly understood what you were asking, my response is that its impractical and in general, not a good idea to try to end sleep.

Its not just neurologically that we need sleep, the body needs time to relax. Did you know stress is the biggest cause of illness? When the mind is stressed this causes cells to enter into a fight or flight mode - where they are expecting some sort of attack on the body. This causes essential living functions only while the rest of bodies resources are pumped to the arms and legs. Normally the body would use these resources for cellular regeneration and warding off disease. Not to say your immune system stops working, only that when stressed, the way your body works changes.

When you are asleep, your body does not need to pump so much blood to the arms and legs, allowing it to move oxygen and any other resources to other areas of the body. The specific place it might send it to is dependent on the needs of the body at the time of sleep. If you were to try to stay awake for a very long time, its likely that the sub-conscious mind would just cause you to black out.

We have evolved to using sleep for a variety of reasons. Its like the Egyptians who thought the brain was a useless part of the body so they disposed of it. Sleep IS essential to us and I don't think we should be trying to end sleep. The people who want more time awake are the ones who use the time they are awake ineffectively. I suggest you read the book, The 4 Hour Work Week.

[dutch84]

My post may have been a little vague given that we have had lengthy discussions about it before and I was half asleep when I answered your question.

I am not making up some voodoo witch doctor pseudo theory about sleep, your body regenerates when your sleeping. What I mean your body goes about cellular regeneration.

Sleep also relieves stress on the body, your bones are carrying a great deal of weight, when you are sleeping this gives your bones a chance to expand again. Your bones expand and contract throughout the day, when they are in a state of constant contraction, this causes arthritis.

Sleep is also used for neurological processing. Much of the free time the sub-conscious has while sleeping is used to process and analyze information. In fact many great inventors including Leonardo Da Vinci were record taking naps after spending a great deal of time working on a problem, only to find the solution upon awakening from sleep.
The processing power of the sub-conscious mind dwarfs the conscious mind. The conscious mind exists for awareness and decision making, like a general leading an army, the sub-conscious is like the army.

I am a bit groggy today or else I might try to remember where I read those REM sleep studies, the results were very fascinating. You have to understand that I read thousands of different scientific studies over the years and remembering where i've read each and every one of them is not likely. I am like a giant storehouse of information, sometimes I even forget I read about something until someone asks me a question related to it.

I perfectly understood what you were asking, my response is that its impractical and in general, not a good idea to try to end sleep.

Its not just neurologically that we need sleep, the body needs time to relax. Did you know stress is the biggest cause of illness? When the mind is stressed this causes cells to enter into a fight or flight mode - where they are expecting some sort of attack on the body. This causes essential living functions only while the rest of bodies resources are pumped to the arms and legs. Normally the body would use these resources for cellular regeneration and warding off disease. Not to say your immune system stops working, only that when stressed, the way your body works changes.

When you are asleep, your body does not need to pump so much blood to the arms and legs, allowing it to move oxygen and any other resources to other areas of the body. The specific place it might send it to is dependent on the needs of the body at the time of sleep. If you were to try to stay awake for a very long time, its likely that the sub-conscious mind would just cause you to black out.

We have evolved to using sleep for a variety of reasons. Its like the Egyptians who thought the brain was a useless part of the body so they disposed of it. Sleep IS essential to us and I don't think we should be trying to end sleep. The people who want more time awake are the ones who use the time they are awake ineffectively. I suggest you read the book, The 4 Hour Work Week.
[/quote]

Everything you've said has reaffirmed my belief that sleep's function is a time for accelerated Cerebral Blood Flow.