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> PNEUMATHERAPY--Based on "pneumatology"--means using the spirit to help heal oneself, Dr. James Braid ( 1795-1860) tried to introduce "monoideism"
Lindsay
post Jul 27, 2006, 09:00 AM
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QUOTE
I (Max) have to agree Rick, time in itself is simply a human way of describing a change in events, nothing more.
And, again in the spirit of dialogue, I do not disagree. I do not think of time as a fixed thing, like the walls of a house. And I am certainly not a Calvinist. I think of myself always on the "cutting edge of time". Furthermore, I like to think of myself as being relatively free to choose in which direction I would like to do the cutting, and where.

About motion. Was it Aristotle who said, "Motion is an infinite series of stops". smile.gif
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pave
post Jul 27, 2006, 12:50 PM
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I think, Lindsay, we're stuck with the term "Hypnosis" as the expenditures of effort to coin another term will only lead to confusion and argument anyway.

As far as any of my clients are concerned, I don't do hypnosis anyway - unless they want me to because they already think there's some validity to it. If not, we're doing.... something else. smile.gif

The key is still in the communicative skills of the practitioner.

Meanwhile, as practitioners, we are still messing with subjective experience and "time" is just one element of that.

Further, we are all operating on an "as-if" basis anyway and that's about as powerful a set-up for other, more useful metaphors as they come.

I have learned you enjoy being a stickler for terms and have coined a few yourself. The trick, I think, is in getting others to buy in - a task in itself. rolleyes.gif
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Lindsay
post Jul 27, 2006, 02:24 PM
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QUOTE(pave @ Jul 27, 12:50 PM) *
...As far as any of my clients are concerned, I don't do hypnosis anyway - unless they want me to because they already think there's some validity to it. If not, we're doing.... something else. smile.gif


Let's face it, Pave, because you want your clients to be in the KNOW, you favour KNOWSIS...smile.gif which, IMO, arises out of the pneuma (the spirit, or self), which is why I favour pneumatherapy--treating to have a healthy spirit.
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pave
post Jul 27, 2006, 07:31 PM
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Actually, Lindsay, my clients are so overwhelmed by information and tasks (overloading the conscious) that they are hardly aware of what day it is.

However, when they test for changes..... well that's another story.

Practically, I work so quickly and address so many issues in our time together (usually 5-6 hours each day for 2 days running) that, when we're through, my clients usually only want to know the way to the exit!

We're both pretty much bagged.

Be assured, however, that, in that time, they are in and out of so many different kinds of trance-states that we'd need a scorecard to keep track.

Fortunately, the Home Team always wins. smile.gif
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Lindsay
post Sep 25, 2006, 02:14 PM
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QUOTE(pave @ Jul 27, 2006, 07:31 PM) *

...
Fortunately, the Home Team always wins. smile.gif
I am sure that all of us could benefit from learning how they do win. Any clues? Does it have anything to do with mastering the NLP technique?
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pave
post Sep 25, 2006, 11:13 PM
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To be sure, Lindsay, as with any set of techniques or rendered services, the results are determined by the skill of the practitioner.

NLP - delivered by an incompetent clod - is just another set of initials. smile.gif
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Lindsay
post Oct 01, 2006, 09:54 PM
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QUOTE(pave @ Sep 25, 2006, 11:13 PM) *

To be sure, Lindsay, as with any set of techniques or rendered services, the results are determined by the skill of the practitioner.

NLP - delivered by an incompetent clod - is just another set of initials. smile.gif
Ah yes, the quality of the human pneuma (spirit or self) is always at work, isn't it? making a difference, one way or another, for better or for worse. It was this factor that encouraged me to revisit this thread and tweak it a little bit.

In the opinion of my pneuma, and in agreement with the opinion of Dr. James Braid, who first coined the word "hypnosis" in 1843, hypnosis--though some, out of habit, will still try to hang on to it--will now take what I feel is its rightful place as a part of the history of the healing arts--an important part no less, but still a part.

Interestingly, the Greek "therapeuo" means to treat a condition or a disease; it does not mean to cure or heal it. All real healing rest with a healthy spirit, thus the importance of pneumatherapy--treating the spirit.
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pave
post Oct 02, 2006, 08:51 AM
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I dunno, Lindsay. While "healing the spirit" is an honourable outcome, most folks are just happy to gain some behavioural control.

In consideration of Logical Levels, "behavioural change" is at the bottom rung while "healing the spirit" is the highest of the high and is so subjective as to be, virtually, unqualifiable and unquantifiable.

The question to a client is: "How will you know, specifically, that your spirit has been healed?" The chances are pretty good the response will be in a behavioural context. ("I won't do this. I will do that. I will feel different/better/not as bad etc.")

And behaviours can be adjusted without going anywhere near "spirit" - whatever that might be. smile.gif

Now, if you're suggesting that the Source-Potential of being able to influence in these matters is a "spiritual" or "consequence-of-pneuma", then well, yes. Maybe. Could be. Don't know.

The point is: there is no necessity to accept the premise of Spirit/Pneuma before worthwhile work can be accomplished.
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Culture
post Oct 02, 2006, 11:14 AM
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QUOTE(Lindsay @ Oct 01, 2006, 09:54 PM) *

Ah yes, the quality of the human pneuma (spirit or self) is always at work, isn't it? making a difference, one way or another, for better or for worse. It was this factor that encouraged me to revisit this thread and tweak it a little bit.

In the opinion of my pneuma, and in agreement with the opinion of Dr. James Braid, who first coined the word "hypnosis" in 1843, hypnosis--though some, out of habit, will still try to hang on to it--will now take what I feel is its rightful place as a part of the history of the healing arts--an important part no less, but still a part.

Interestingly, the Greek "therapeuo" means to treat a condition or a disease; it does not mean to cure or heal it. All real healing rest with a healthy spirit, thus the importance of pneumatherapy--treating the spirit.



Pneumatherapy. I decided to have a look at the definitions of pneuma. Coming from a linguistic background and doing a simple appleid linguistics exercise it (πνευμα) seems to point to breathing/air/wind/spirit. So I am a bit confused by what you mean by "the opinion of my pneuma...."

Nonetheless the way that I perceive pneuma would probably be more in line with the the martial arts that I practise which is Chi/Qi/Ki.

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Lindsay
post Oct 02, 2006, 04:14 PM
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QUOTE(Culture @ Oct 02, 2006, 11:14 AM) *

...Pneumatherapy. I decided to have a look at the definitions of pneuma. Coming from a linguistic background and doing a simple appleid linguistics exercise it (πνευμα) seems to point to breathing/air/wind/spirit. So I am a bit confused by what you mean by "the opinion of my pneuma...." [Culture, like the Bible often does, I speak metaphorically!!!]

Nonetheless the way that I perceive pneuma would probably be more in line with the the martial arts that I practise which is Chi/Qi/Ki.
Good for you, Culture. IMO, chi (Chinese), spirito (Latin), ruach (Hebrew), ruh (Arabic), pneuma (Greek) are all translations for what we call, spirit

You probably will be interested in knowing that, in the New Testament Greek, "pneuma" is used, exclusively, to refer to the human spirit. Add the adjective "holy" (hagio) and we have "pneumati hagio"--referring to the Holy Spirit of God. See John 1:33.
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maximus242
post Oct 02, 2006, 05:14 PM
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Then I disagree with replacing Hypnosis with Pneumatherapy, it has more presuppositions than Hypnosis.
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Lindsay
post Oct 02, 2006, 08:04 PM
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QUOTE(maximus242 @ Oct 02, 2006, 05:14 PM) *

Then I disagree with replacing Hypnosis with Pneumatherapy, it has more presuppositions than Hypnosis.
Max, I trust we can argee to disagree, agreeably.

I agree with Braid. Ironically, he was the coiner of the word, hypnosis. He soon discovered that the trance phenomenon is more about the strengthening of our ability to focus and keep our mind on what we are doing. In the best sense of the concept, it is probably more like NLP, Neuro Linguistic Programming--the Dr. Milton Erickson kind of "hypnosis"--than the stage variety.

As my mentor, Canon Joseph Wittkofski,who was a biologist as well as a minister and "hypnotist", said as he thanked me for making my point about the nature of the trance: "I agree" he said, "that the trance phenomenon has more in common with helping people achieve a wide-awake spirituality than with anything else. It is about really waking up, not going to sleep. I like linking it with pneumatology."

He also agreed that because of stage hypnosis, the movies, the media and public perception, hypnosis did have a lot of hocus pocus baggage about it. Even some "stage hypnotists" call themselves "mentalists".

It was later that I coined "pneumatherapy".

I JUST CAME ACROSS THIS--a good definition of NLP:
http://www.hypnosisenergy.com/nlp_whatis.html
Now this sounds like "pneumatherapy" to me. Not the usual kind of hypnosis in which "subjects" are manipulated by a "master". I guess the author is using any word that will get public attention. BTW, I am not opposed to this, if it works.
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pave
post Oct 02, 2006, 09:29 PM
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To presume that pneumatherapy - as opposed to "hypnosis" - would be a better replacement term is to presume that people are willing to accept a "spiritual" quality to the methods/methodology of that which is already broadly accepted as "hypnosis".

That's just adding even more baggage to a field that is already rife with sets of Samsonite. smile.gif
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Culture
post Oct 03, 2006, 01:05 PM
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QUOTE(Culture @ Oct 02, 2006, 11:14 AM) *

...Pneumatherapy. I decided to have a look at the definitions of pneuma. Coming from a linguistic background and doing a simple appleid linguistics exercise it (πνευμα) seems to point to breathing/air/wind/spirit. So I am a bit confused by what you mean by "the opinion of my pneuma...."[

Nonetheless the way that I perceive pneuma would probably be more in line with the the martial arts that I practise which is Chi/Qi/Ki.


QUOTE(Lindsay @ Oct 02, 2006, 04:14 PM) *

Good for you, Culture. IMO, chi (Chinese), spirito (Latin), ruach (Hebrew), ruh (Arabic), pneuma (Greek) are all translations for what we call, spirit

You probably will be interested in knowing that, in the New Testament Greek, "pneuma" is used, exclusively, to refer to the human spirit. Add the adjective "holy" (hagio) and we have "pneumati hagio"--referring to the Holy Spirit of God. See John 1:33.


I do not agree with your definition/interpretation of pneuma, From the Greek the root meaning is a movement of air, as in breath. Think pneumatic tires. I think the word pneuma took on the meaning of "spirit" mainly because of Christianity.

Correct me if I am wrong. Pneuma (greek) is neuter as opposed to the hebrew ruach which is feminine. So if one should interpret pneuma as 'spirit' (neuter) it would be somewhat sexist to say the least.


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Lindsay
post Oct 03, 2006, 08:38 PM
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QUOTE(pave @ Oct 02, 2006, 09:29 PM) *

To presume that pneumatherapy - as opposed to "hypnosis"...
I use pneumatherapy--others are free to use any word they see fit to use--as a step beyond "hypnosis" (sleep-like state), not in opposition to it. We in the West owe a debt of gratitude to the early pioneers of in this field sometimes refered to as the "New Thought movement": Franz Mesmer, The Count Del La Fontaine, Phineas T. Quimby, Milton Erickson, and others.
#####################################
A new name here, you will find many details about Quimby at:
http://svpvril.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=171
For an excellent survey of the ancient and modern history of those who have used the power of the human spirit to heal, check out:
http://www.breakthroughinstitute.com/history_of_hypnosis.htm
#####################################

BTW, today, I used what I call pneumatherapy--a kind of therapy where the client is asked to be an active participant in the healing team and process. I used it on a person who asked me to help him/her in dealing with a severe physical addiction to food (the presenting somatological, or physical, problem). In addition, during the process, it came out that the person was under a great deal of mental and emotional stress caused by guilt and fear brought on by bad past experiences (the psychological problem). It, also, came out that the person had, been an alcoholic and a member of a dysfunctional family.

TRANCE OR SLEEP-LIKE TRADITIONAL HYPNOSIS NOT NECESSARY
Though I see nothing wrong with suggesting relaxation, at no point did I ask the person to behave like a "subject", to look at a focal point--certainly not into my eyes--and go into "sleep, deep sleep..." which is what most people have in mind when they hear the word "hypnosis".

PNEUMATHERAPY INVOLVES USE OF THE EDUCATIVE PROCESS. IT SEEKS TO DEVELOP RAPPORT BETWEEN EQUALS, NOT THAT OF A MASTER OVER A SUBJECT, OR EVEN THAT OF A DOCTOR WITH PATIENT.

Like I have done many times before, I simply explained the nature and role of the three factors we all use--the physical, mental and spiritual (soma, psyche and pneuma)-- and which make up who we are as human beings. I spent two thirds of my time communicating and building a rapport with the person. During the rest of the time, I called the person's attention to the his/her pneumatological role--that of being spiritually involved and as one with the power to make choices.

Accepting our social responsibility as pneumatological, or spiritual beings, is, in my opinion, foundational to our spiritual, mental and physical well-being. This helps us focuss on, and stick with, the kind of choices which promote and maintain total health.

I suggested to the client: "You will use YOUR pneumatological power, which is now fully awakened in you. You will educate yourself, and help you heal what has gone wrong in your body, mind and your relationships. You will, carefully, look at how you are breathing and what you are eating. In addition, you will carefully look at what is going on in you mind, and emotions, and you will have the confidence to deal courageously with, not only what you are eating, but what is eating you".

BTW 2, Dr. James Braid--the same Dr. Braid who coined the word "hypnosis"--must have felt the "hypnosis" was a misnomer and carried the wrong message, otherwise why did he try to change the term to "monoideism"? I agree with Braid; his use of "hypnosis", from the Greek for sleep, is not the best workd for this phenomenon.
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Lindsay
post Dec 11, 2006, 06:00 AM
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Just testing to see if I can post this here. Could not post it in the other thread on memory. Some kind of a bug?
=================================================
Piracetam seems to help with memory as does vinpocetine.
[/quote] I found the following interesting. Is it just a lot of hype?

http://www.ceri.com/noot.htm

Interestingly, it did work, here, but not other threads I tried. I wonder why.
Perhaps the pneumatological factor guided me back to this thread.

Flex, et al, you may be interested in looking into pneumatology--the science of the spirit.
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Lindsay
post Dec 11, 2006, 09:22 AM
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And t his looks interesting:
http://www.ceri.com/index.shtml

THE COGNITIVE ENHANCEMENT RESEARCH INSTITUTE
Post Office Box 4029, Menlo Park, California, 94026 USA
Phone: 650-321-CERI (650-321-2374)
Fax: 650-323-3864

Welcome to the CERI web site. We have several hundred files linked to this site. These files are organized into seven menus, each of which can be accessed by clicking on a yellow diamond (the bullets to the left of text descriptions) or an underlined and/or highlighted piece of text. To return to this home page, click on the return-to-CERI-home-page option at the bottom of each menu, or at the top of each web page — or use the “back” button on your web browser program.

This web site is read-only. That means that 1) there is lots of free information to be had here, and 2) you can't buy anything at this site. If you want to place an order online, you will have to transfer to our Smart Life News Store, which is now up and running, selling subscriptions, back issues, and — the latest thing — immediate downloads of newsletters, bundles and collections. Buy it, download it directly to your computer, and read it right away. For more information about downloading newsletters, click here: http://ceri.stores.yahoo.net/
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post Dec 11, 2006, 11:34 AM
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QUOTE
I strongly suggested, strongly, to the client: "You will use your pneumatological power, which are now fully awakened in you, to educate yourself, and help you heal what has gone wrong in your body, mind and your relationships. You will carefully look at how you are breathing and what you are eating. In addition, you will carefully look at what is going on in you mind, and emotions, and you will have the confidence to deal courageously with, not only what you are eating, but what is eating you".



As you strongly suggested strongly, you are assuming that what you say has some meaning to the client. By superimposing a thought, be it positive or of some meaning (to you) onto the clients mind, the client might buy into what you have suggested and rearrange the thoughts but the basic programs of being are still there within the subconscious.
Just as hypnosis has no way of wiping out internal programs, offering new thoughts to pile onto the old ones does not change the foundation of belief and experience. One must lead one to their own experience of themselves that is greater than the old. By building a relationship with this greater self one naturally lets go of the lesser beliefs in separation and toad like sense of self worth.

The spirit of each individual doesn't need therapy because the spirit is immortal and without flaw. The relationship each one has with spirit is not only predetermined before inhabiting the body but it cannot be altered by the opinions of others nor can another see the perfection of spirit in another when their relationship continues to be based in duality and the belief that they can envision a better reality than what God has created.

IF the spiritual power was fully awakened you would not have to tell one that it is so. They would be fully aware of it.
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Lindsay
post Dec 23, 2010, 02:44 PM
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Friends at BM: Using twitter, recently, I just found out about the following:

http://www.hypnothoughts.com/forum/topics/...e=msg_com_forum

Anyone, care to check it out let me know what you think.

Meanwhile, have a Merry Christmas, and a Happy 2011.
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Lindsay
post Nov 18, 2014, 03:16 PM
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QUOTE(pave @ Jul 23, 2006, 11:07 AM) *
Hi mike!

I am enjoying these threads and the participants very much.

As to AJ showing up: sooner is better than later! smile.gif


Same old Pave, I used to know? When the BOOMER went BOOM!!!
===========================================
LET THERE BE LIGHT--

Light is made up of all colours, its seems:
The BLUEs, the YELLOWs, the REDs & the GREENs

So: Every, A.M., as I awake,
The first thing that I do?
I think of these beautiful colours--
Green, Red, Yellow and Blue.

Pneumatologically speaking,
I take it that BLUE means, "I am";
I take with Yellow I KNOW
Now I add to the factor of WISDOM.
So Red means I DO & GREEN means, I Grow!!!
======================
Now, bring on the music, Pave.
BTW, if I can find the links, Turner King in on FaceBook and i-Tunes



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Lindsay
post Nov 18, 2014, 03:45 PM
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QUOTE(Lindsay @ Nov 18, 2014, 06:16 PM) *
QUOTE(pave @ Jul 23, 2006, 11:07 AM) *
Hi mike!

I am enjoying these threads and the participants very much.

As to AJ showing up: sooner is better than later! smile.gif


Same old Pave, I used to know? When the BOOMER went BOOM!!!
===========================================
LET THERE BE LIGHT--

Light is made up of all colours, its seems:
The BLUEs, the YELLOWs, the REDs & the GREENs

So: Every, A.M., as I awake,
The first thing that I do?
I think of these beautiful colours--
Green, Red, Yellow and Blue.

Pneumatologically speaking,
I take it that BLUE means, "I am";
I take with Yellow I KNOW
Now I add to the factor of WISDOM.
So Red means I DO & GREEN means, I Grow!!!
======================
Now, bring on the music, Pave.
BTW, if I can find the links, Turner King in on FaceBook and i-Tunes
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Alan peterson
post Mar 25, 2015, 03:35 AM
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'Gnosis'. My World Book Dictionary defines it as 1. knowledge. 2. a special knowledge of spiritual things, hnece its connection with spiritual things. It is from New Latin and Greek gnosis. It also carries the idea of investigating all things to gain knowledge without being dependent on blind faith, or revelation.
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