Prof Kaku's version of the parallel universe, Prof Kaku's version of the parallel universe Options

[Soma]

I've been thinking about Prof Kaku's version of the parallel universe
theory. His version basically says that "baby" universes form on the
surface of our universe under black-hole scale concentrations of mass,
and eventually they tear off completely, severing the "umbilical cord"
that is a black hole in a parent universe, feeding a a white hole in the
fledgling universe, which is simply spewing out matter and energy (this
is no different from them big bang our universe experienced) So, for
every black hole forms in our universe, it spawns a big bang that grows
into a child universe... matter and energy keep getting funneled into
this black hole, and out into this parallel universe big-bang event and
eventually when it's had enough it disconnects itself.

I'm not sure if I like this...

First of all, it means that there is hard-limit on the amount of times
this can happen. There is a limit to how many generations of universe
can be "born" as all the matter and energy gets siphoned off the higher
generations into lower ones, eventually a universe will be either be
born without enough stuff to form it's own black hold and "give birth"
or, perhaps it won't be able to absorb enough matter/energy from it's
parent to actually disconnect itself, at which point it's a wart on the
surface of ours... what would this be like? Two universes joined by a
black-hole, matter and energy being bounced between them and generally
making universal heat-death for both twice as fast as it should have
been? Or maybe it'll just absorb it's parent altogether and conserve
matter/energy that way... You now have universe full of matter that
periodically squeezes itself through a black hole. It's the same
universe just giving rise to itself over and over again... a totally
stubby universe?

You can get around all this by adding a "fountain of stuff" to our
current universe, a "white hole" he called it, but the existence of such
a thing would simply mean that we've not yet cut the umbilical cord from
our parent. Perhaps there is a "queen universe" at the top of it all,
that is being constantly fed, and constantly spawning off sprogs that
eventually die When I say, die, I mean "heat death"... where there all
the goodstuff is so evenly averaged out that there is no potential for
any work to be done... perfect entropy or perhaps cold death, where the
sprogs inflate cooling themselves as they do simply freeze over...
either way, you have universes worth of matter an energy going to
waste... it would be elegant if the queen universe at the top of this
all was nourished by dead and/or sterile universes... can't suppose how
this would happen though.

The worst thing about this is that it leaves us in the same boat...
just on a different scale, the eventuality will be all matter and energy
becoming useless, not just in our universe, but on a multiversal
scale... the original big universe will die, having given all it's
goodstuff away to generations of universes that will eventually become
so watered down they can't reproduce. Multiversal death... which I'm
reliably told "sucks ass".

[Rick]

I agree. The baby universes through black holes theory violates the second law of thermodynamics. Big bangs are really hot. Where does the heat come from? Stuff falling into black holes will be heated by compression and friction, but it won't get that hot.

Secondly, the origin is a bang, not a trickle. Black holes have matter trickle into them for long periods. If our universe came from a black hole, where is the trickling input?

I think it's most likely as Stephen Hawking said at his recent lecture at Cal. Tech.: universe bubbles form spontaneously from nothing much as bubbles form in water as it begins to boil. Most bubbles are too small and collapse back into nothing. Occasionally a bubble forms that is large enough to sustain itself and it expands infinitely forming a universe.

[Trip like I do]

[Trip like I do]

So according to this theory, we are at the end of a white hole that has sucked out matter from another universe through a black hole, and could this white hole still be pushing forth material, hence the current accelerated expansion rate? And that this is also the mysterious 73% Dark Energy that we don't see?

[Rick]

By Kaku's theory, baby universes must be less massive than their parent universe. Therefore, if our universe is a baby universe under that theory, its parent must be enormous. A galactic nuclear black hole is simply too small to spawn what we are witnessing as our own big bang. That was part of Soma's original point.

[Trip like I do]

Sorry. Rickster > I just skimmed and a few trigger words caught my attention, where external stimuli (words) created instantaneous synaptic sparks of certain neurons in my biologically evolved (from the primordial atoms in the cosmic soup) brain and illicited a response via my response.

[Trip like I do]

[Rick]

Slow down and be more circumspect. No known universe is capable of gravitational collapse.

[Trip like I do]

I agree, none are known.

[Trip like I do]

http://www.iscid.org/papers/Stephan_Tegmar...rses_042903.pdf

[Hey Hey]

some yeast reproduce by budding. when the progeny (bud) leaves, a bud scar is left. eventually the parent yeast is covered in scars and can no longer reproduce. it then dies - ahh. not withstanding the energetics, maybe the universe reproduces. (which universe, who knows). eventually it will be unable to reproduce further - ahh. but the story doesn't end there. the progeny yeasts grow and become reproducing units, and the budding starts all over again. hey.... maybe the universe is alive! maybe that is what life is! now for the energetics....any offers?

[Trip like I do]

I've just purchased this book today, and am giving it the initial once over.

[Trip like I do]

Because the ancient tao masters knew that there are many parallel realities, they developed ways of accessing these by studying the ways in which energy works within given sets of circumstances.

To the Tao master the only thing that exists in the universe is energy, and the existence of all other phenomena is related directly to that energy and governed by it under immutable universal laws.

It has been known and recorded in China for some 3000 years that many parallel realities exist in the same space and at the same time and are kept seperate by vibratory differences in the energies.

[Trip like I do]

Christianity - the heaven having many mansions.

Shinto - seven heavens.

Hindu reference many levels.

Krishna indicates other dimensions or levels of existence.

[Trip like I do]

Down through the ages, many races, cultures and philosophies have alluded in their writings to the existence of other dimensions.

[Trip like I do]

Insights from todays theoretical physicists corresponds with the views of reality as passed down through history by enlightened sages who had evolved beyond consciousness to a state of pure awareness.

The human energy field has been described as having a higher frequency or vibration than normal matter-energy.

It has been put forward that human beings are made up of energy that is vibrating in a certain pattern - normally, particles forming a wave pattern (a vibrational pattern in space and time) Capra, 1976.

Capra wants his readers to "picture our wave packet not as a pattern in space but as a vibrational pattern in time...the vibrational pattern represents therefore the uncertainty in the temporal location of the event" (p. 168).

If the vibrational rate of human energy could be increased to match that of another field vibrating at the same rate, the possibility could exist that the two energies would meld into one, the two parallels merging, perhaps resulting in the human energy field transcending into the different time and space dimension of the other field.

[Hey Hey]

[Trip like I do]

Maybe history's sages were drug induced. So what! It just seems that what they hypothesized then is becoming today's reality.

[Hey Hey]

sages can fool some of the people some of the time........

......there would have been enough sages to come up with almost any permutation of future events. depends which side of the crystal ball you are looking into.

if drug supporters could only try using the native brain they might find that it can produce wonders - or not! maybe we could shelve some nootropics for the time being. but no, my background still tells me there is no drug without side-effects - what are nootropics today are the teratogens (and more, or other) of tomorrow.

maybe the sages used sage! certainly the pseudoscientific sages, through to dark age scientists, and on to modern scientists haven't explain a jot of nature to 100%, or even close. Or else, what is matter, how did the universe begin, how will it end, how is glucose taken up into the intestine, what causes Alzheimer's, what is mind, and what is time, (what is God!)? Just a few for starters. Try looking up a few papers on each and you'll find incompleteness and turnarounds. How much more time and money do we need to cure cancer, malaria, the common cold,...,....,....,....,....,...? Nobel Prizes are not given for solutions, but for progress (could be 0.0000001% of the full answer).

yes, sages were like religeous leaders; out for the fame, power and money.

[Hey Hey]

Changed their minds again eh?

Wormhole wanderers face a deadly dilemma

Would-be wormhole travellers may have to choose between danger and
unpredictability for their journeys through space-time, a new study
reveals. The research may spell doom for time machines, but it
suggests the universe will survive to a ripe old age instead of
being ripped apart by a particularly repulsive form of dark energy.

Go to the link below for the full story on NewScientistSpace.com:
http://www.newscientistspace.com/article/d...ly-dilemma.html

[Jakare]

Rick said:
I agree. The baby universes through black holes theory violates the second law of thermodynamics. Big bangs are really hot. Where does the heat come from? Stuff falling into black holes will be heated by compression and friction, but it won't get that hot.

Secondly, the origin is a bang, not a trickle. Black holes have matter trickle into them for long periods. If our universe came from a black hole, where is the trickling input?

I think it's most likely as Stephen Hawking said at his recent lecture at Cal. Tech.: universe bubbles form spontaneously from nothing much as bubbles form in water as it begins to boil. Most bubbles are too small and collapse back into nothing. Occasionally a bubble forms that is large enough to sustain itself and it expands infinitely forming a universe.

Both theories could be true. It is thought space and TIME collapse in black holes, isn´t it?
It is known quantum particles can be at several places at the same time. What could happen to them if TIME is cut off the equation? All the posibilities would express themselves (decay all together) at the same Time in the same or different spaces and therefore will the black hole´s mass grow exponentially and not directly proportional to the absorbed matter´s mass.
Such theory could be tested if having meassured up the gravitational force of a given black hole before absorbing a star. If the resulting gravitational force is directly proportional to the star´s mass addition then the theory failed, but what if the gravitational force has grown over previous expectations?
Wouldn´t the 'sudden' (well time pass is somewhat subjective and that sudden could be trillions of millions of years) release of such exponentially multiplied mass be enough to create a big-bang?

Feel free to abuse me (verbally) for reviving this old thread