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> Stablon is a smart drug
Tone
post Mar 30, 2006, 08:41 PM
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trust me, youll feel a lot more focused and improved from taking stablon than any of the other smart drugs like paracetam or huperzine. stablon has a huge effect on neuroplasticity. stablon makes your brain process information faster and easier. its a real head clearer with no side effects. it feels good to lower excess serotonin, excess serotonin is so inhibitory, so stuplifying, makes you feel all weird, gets in the way. you know, MDMA doesnt owe its great effects just to serotonin release.. it actually lowers serotonin activity in the limbic system. Raised Serotonin being good is a myth, thats why people take SSRIs and feel like shit.

research stablon if youd like

http://www.tianeptine.com/
http://www.stablon.com/
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rhymer
post Mar 31, 2006, 11:53 AM
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Well Tone, I don't think trust comes into it!

I've been taking SSRI's for 15 years and have only witnessed improvements to my health.

From what I've read about Stabilon which works with an opposite mechanism to SSRI's, I admit that I am confused, since both work for different people.
Either we suffer from too much or too little serotonin in synapses, or maybe either an increase or decrease is beneficial.

A good experiment would be for SSRI users and Stabilon users to swap drugs and see what effect that has on each.
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Rick
post Mar 31, 2006, 01:40 PM
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I read once somewhere that there is a theory that the serotonin antagonist LSD works by reducing serotonin initially. Then the psychedelic affect is caused by a rebounding inrush of serotonin. If that's true, why aren't the SSRIs psychedelics?
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xanadu
post Mar 31, 2006, 03:42 PM
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I'd prefer to get info from a place that doesn't sell the stuff. Piracetam has been researched for decades and seems to have no toxicity at all. Can you say the same for stablon? What have your experiences been with it and how long have you used it?
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LifeMirage
post Mar 31, 2006, 08:41 PM
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QUOTE
I'd prefer to get info from a place that doesn't sell the stuff.


Difficult (as most/many studies are done from the company that produces the drug) but a careful search of pubmed may reveal some independent research.
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Tone
post Apr 01, 2006, 09:22 PM
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I just took stablon and had heavy euphoria for 45 minutes followed by a clearing of my head rather than a crash. enjoy your SSRIs lol
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Tone
post Apr 01, 2006, 09:31 PM
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How would you like to have a drug that does not use liver CYP nor kidneys to metabolize or clear? What if it was so safe that people took hundreds of tablets a day with no toxic effects? I think ill stick to using 4 tablets when i use it, i like mine to last.



----

The authors report a case of tianeptine abuse in a 30 year-old woman. After a medical prescription of the recommended dosage of 12.5 mg 3 times daily of oral tianeptine for a depressive illness, the patient spontaneously increased the dosage which after two months reached 150 tablets per day. No severe toxic effects were observed. As adverse effects, the patient, in the beginning of this high treatment period suffered from nausea, vomiting, abdominal pain, anorexia with weight loss, constipation. These side effects progressively disappeared. The biological tolerance was excellent, and hepatic parameters were not affected. The patient experienced and seek a psychostimulant effect. After seven months of such a therapy, she was hospitalized to undergo a withdrawal. The discontinuation of the tianeptine treatment occurs in four days. A withdrawal syndrome marked by myalgia, and cold feeling was transient, and alleviated by sedative phenothiazine (cyamemazine) and myorelaxant benzodiazepine (tetrazepam).

----

We report on a tianeptine dependence lasting for eighteen months in a 42 year old patient. The patient had a previous history of addiction to opiates, amineptine, cocaine and alcohol. He also had a family history of addiction to alcohol and opiates. Tianeptine was prescribed for a major depressive disorder. The patient alleged a "flash sensation" like with heroin since the very first doses with a physical and psychological well-being sensation, better psychomotor performances and transient mood elation. His addiction to tianeptine was immediate and heavy. The positive reinforcement faded away after one month and a total dependance took over, with physical and psychological withdrawal symptoms when doses were not renewed. After two months of treatment, the daily consumption of tianeptine was of 90 tablets. The patient was hospitalised to treat both the addiction to tianeptine and the ongoing major depressive disorder. He was taking 240 tablets daily. In the literature, reports of addictions to antidepressants are scarce and most of them involve agents with amphetamine-like properties, including amineptine and tranylcypromine. Other reports involving other antidepressant agents, including amitriptyline, fluoxetine and tianeptine remain exceptional. Addictions to antidepressants almost exclusively concern patients with a diagnosis of personality disorder and a previous history of drug or alcohol abuse and who are treated for a depressive disorder. Tianeptine, which is devoid of any psychostimulating effect in human, does not seem to have addictive properties apart from the reports of scarce cases.

http://www.biopsychiatry.com/tianeptine-addict.htm
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xanadu
post Apr 03, 2006, 01:07 PM
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Is tianeptine the same as stablon? It sounds addictive. There is always a price to pay for stimulants.
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LifeMirage
post Apr 03, 2006, 01:20 PM
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Yes it is the same. And no it's not addictive. Nor is it a stimulant.
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Hey Hey
post Apr 03, 2006, 02:40 PM
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QUOTE(Rick @ Mar 31, 10:40 PM) *

If that's true, why aren't the SSRIs psychedelics?


Ssshhhhh! Or they'll stop prescribing them to us!
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xanadu
post Apr 04, 2006, 03:58 PM
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I don't know, I think I'll sit this out out for a while until a few years of reports come in. Maybe I'm missing out on a good thing but I just read some reports on modafinil over on that other site which shall remain nameless. Modafinil of course is not the same as this drug but some of the things said about it sound like what are being said about stablon. I know that proves nothing but stop to think that modafinil is approved over here by prescription, from what I've heard. It's been spoken of as a nootropic which I don't believe it is. The guy in europe who sells it said himself it was a stimulant. I heard from people who got hooked after a honeymoon period. Up to then, they thought it was the safest thing on the market. Now I'm hearing hype about ampekines (sp?). They are said to be wonderful much as stablon is said to be wonderful.

I'm not trying to warn anyone away from this new discovery. We need the early adopters much like we need canaries in the mine. It may be the best thing to come along since piracetam or even better. I'll just have to miss out for now. But keep those reports coming, I love to hear feedback about stuff like that. Anyone else been using stablon? Anybody ordered it, what does it cost?
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da_sense
post Apr 22, 2006, 08:03 AM
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QUOTE(xanadu @ Apr 05, 01:58 AM) *

I don't know, I think I'll sit this out out for a while until a few years of reports come in. Maybe I'm missing out on a good thing but I just read some reports on modafinil over on that other site which shall remain nameless. Modafinil of course is not the same as this drug but some of the things said about it sound like what are being said about stablon. I know that proves nothing but stop to think that modafinil is approved over here by prescription, from what I've heard. It's been spoken of as a nootropic which I don't believe it is. The guy in europe who sells it said himself it was a stimulant. I heard from people who got hooked after a honeymoon period. Up to then, they thought it was the safest thing on the market. Now I'm hearing hype about ampekines (sp?). They are said to be wonderful much as stablon is said to be wonderful.

I'm not trying to warn anyone away from this new discovery. We need the early adopters much like we need canaries in the mine. It may be the best thing to come along since piracetam or even better. I'll just have to miss out for now. But keep those reports coming, I love to hear feedback about stuff like that. Anyone else been using stablon? Anybody ordered it, what does it cost?


"Guy in Europe" as da_sense?? wink.gif
Don't mix apples and pears. Modafinil is drug for narcolepsy. It can be used for other causes, but it's primarily stimulant, to keep one awake. Due to this it might "clear" mind for those who feel sleepy and such. But still it's a stimulant more similar to caffeine than Tianeptine.
Tianeptine on other hand is a antidepressive drug. But the research has shown some unique properties which i belive classify it as a nootropics as well. I've never used tianeptine so I can't comment on it's effects (i use deprenyl which has similar effects).
While you can get addicted to anything good, modafinil has much higher abuse potential, is you can feel it's effects right away and they can be strong if you take 500mg or more. Tianeptine is more subtle and not stimulatory and i don't think you can get addicted to tianeptine. At least i never heard someone got addicted to it.
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da_sense
post Apr 22, 2006, 08:05 AM
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BTW this got me thinking of trying tianeptine. But the cost of 3x tabs of tianeptine a day is much higher than 5 mg deprenyl daily...
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Tone
post Apr 22, 2006, 08:14 PM
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You can take selegiline, not feel any smarter or any increase in focus at all, but be rest assured of antioxidant properties, or you can take stablon and actually feel results.
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da_sense
post Apr 23, 2006, 12:43 AM
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QUOTE(Tone @ Apr 23, 06:14 AM) *

You can take selegiline, not feel any smarter or any increase in focus at all, but be rest assured of antioxidant properties, or you can take stablon and actually feel results.


selegiline = deprenyl wink.gif
i've been on 5 mg daily for the last 10 months, it really changed my life
best possible motivator, not so much for "feeling smarter" but can't beat it's motivation, and that's what i needed most
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kLee
post Apr 25, 2006, 07:21 AM
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Is it safe to take deprenyl and tianeptine? On a long term basis..
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LifeMirage
post Apr 25, 2006, 11:15 AM
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For a healthy person yes.
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da_sense
post Apr 25, 2006, 04:24 PM
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QUOTE(kLee @ Apr 25, 05:21 PM) *

Is it safe to take deprenyl and tianeptine? On a long term basis..


I'm 26 and i started taking 5 mg deprenyl last june. I really changed my life. I found Deprenyl to be best for dopamine and motivation
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Promicarus
post Jun 27, 2006, 11:51 AM
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QUOTE(Tone @ Mar 30, 08:41 PM) *

trust me, youll feel a lot more focused and improved from taking stablon than any of the other smart drugs like paracetam or huperzine. stablon has a huge effect on neuroplasticity. stablon makes your brain process information faster and easier. its a real head clearer with no side effects. it feels good to lower excess serotonin, excess serotonin is so inhibitory, so stuplifying, makes you feel all weird, gets in the way. you know, MDMA doesnt owe its great effects just to serotonin release.. it actually lowers serotonin activity in the limbic system. Raised Serotonin being good is a myth, thats why people take SSRIs and feel like shit.

research stablon if youd like

http://www.tianeptine.com/
http://www.stablon.com/

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Promicarus
post Jun 27, 2006, 12:15 PM
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[quote name='Promicarus' date='Jun 27, 11:51 AM' post='66667']
[quote name='Tone' post='61986' date='Mar 30, 08:41 PM']


having been diagnosed with "medication resistant depression" (gotta love the psyche terms--always seem to conveniently point the finger at the patient for having failed to improved under the respective Dr.'s care--COULDN'T be that he/she didn't have the slightest idea what they were doing...who me resentful?) Anyway..I've taken--while not EVERYTHING in the book, very nearly that..to no avail.
Happened across the tianeptine data online, and started looking into its mechanism of action--and low and behold, rather than "create a pool" of serotonin, which--the current U.S pharm theory dictates--it makes that serotonin more available to synapses which benefit from it-essentially, causes the synapses to SUCK it up, hungrily. And what happens when the body is using up anything...the body makes more!!!!!!
Turns out, tianeptine is a SSRP--selective serotonin reuptake PROMOTOR...and it would seem that, the more the synapses use-via tianep.--the more is naturally created! Add to this new data that much of the 'Pool' of serotonin the SSRI creates simply dissipates randomly into surrounding tissue-causing as-yet known effects--and it would seem as though the SSRI guys are going about it all the wrong way! Curious that it's banned in the U.S. huh?
Interestingly enough, it's also been demonstrated to promote neural growth in both the hippocampus and hypothalmus--those areas gradually eroded by excess stress--and that it's been tested with startling efficacy in those with chronic P.T.S.D. (who have cortisol related hypothalmus and hippocampus damage as a result of stress)--and it begins to become clear-is why it's been banned. After all--the FDA had NO JUSTIFICATION for having banned it, in the first place! No negative results to speak of, not even the odd, random negative incident! Thing is,it just may CURE people--and god forbid Pharm co.s got in the business of doing that! But that's another story...
No, I'm not denying your experience--If your SSRI has worked for you, great. Problem with SSRIs? Your brain eventually "realizes" that there's far too much serotonin around, much more than is being used...so it DOWN REGULATES SEROTONIN PRODUCTION!--AND THEN WHAT ARE YOU STUCK WITH?..THE NEED TO TAKE MORE AND MORE, JUST TO GET THE SAME EFFECT...AND WORSE, THE INABILITY TO QUIT,AS YOUR BODY'S ALREADY--STOPPED PRODUCING THE SEROTONIN IT SHOULD BE--AND EVEN WAS IN THE FIRST PLACE!!! YOU'RE HOOKED, BABY, THAT'S WHAT. A Pharm corp. junkie bit*h. ASK THOSE WHO'VE TAKEN PAXIL, ASK ABOUT PROZAC DOSAGE ESCALATION....THEN ASK YOURSELF AGAIN WHETHER YOU'RE really BETTER OFF--- IN THE....LONG RUN.
Tianep has even been demonstrated as having a positive effect on the HPA axis--that's the gland/brain conjunction which is responsible for our "losing our sh*t" in stressfull situations--no not through sedation, by any means. In fact, it's been demonstrated to have both some stimulating and some anxiolytic properties-but no real "sedation"to speak of (and believe me, I know sedation)

Maybe an excess of serotonin leeching indiscriminately into your brain tissue is what you need--there is a calming affect associated with it, after all. But don't kid yourself that it's making any difference where the efficiency of effectiveness of natural, optimally effective neural transmissions are concerned.
Right on about the neuroplasticity,too--if you don't believe, do the research yourself--but don't scoff--scoffing is for armchair cynics. By the way--it's the first thing--of the probably 20 I've tried-ove the last 15 years of continuous searching, that actually WORKS--I'd long ago given up hope, of having a relatively normal life, as a matter of fact, must less enjoying it in the least. So don't--give up-- until you've tried tianept.

Truth.
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Promicarus
post Jun 27, 2006, 12:36 PM
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QUOTE(Rick @ Mar 31, 01:40 PM) *

I read once somewhere that there is a theory that the serotonin antagonist LSD works by reducing serotonin initially. Then the psychedelic affect is caused by a rebounding inrush of serotonin. If that's true, why aren't the SSRIs psychedelics?

Serotonin is not a serotoninc "antagonist"--it's serotonin-related receptor site agonist --meaning it "opens them all up"--in hippie lingo, so to speak. As far as LSD actually promoting the production of serotonin, I'm not sure.
But it does enable the serotonin that's there to have completely free reign.
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Promicarus
post Jun 27, 2006, 12:44 PM
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QUOTE(xanadu @ Mar 31, 03:42 PM) *

I'd prefer to get info from a place that doesn't sell the stuff. Piracetam has been researched for decades and seems to have no toxicity at all. Can you say the same for stablon? What have your experiences been with it and how long have you used it?



Obviously, your concern regarding the longstanding record of Stablon (Tianeptine) is valid. However, it has been in production and has been prescribed regularly throughout Europe for approx. 25 years, now--with no accompanying reports of adverse reactions. That's certainly more than can be said for the majortiy of most recent releases in the U.S. market. Obviously, again, one must weight his subjective need with the degree of risk with which he is comfortable assuming in attmept to meet those needs. Nothing is absolutelywithout risk. I'm sorry to inform you that you may be the first, one and only, individual ever to suffer painful death (or for that matter,any slight inconvenience) from having taken Stablon--but yes, you make a good point: That's always a possibility. It certainly is nice when others perform independent research before asking pointed and derrogatory questions--but I suppose that's not nearly as fun,is it?
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kLee
post Jun 28, 2006, 07:22 AM
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Got a maybe dumb question about tianeptine usage. I'm thinking of taking once per day (instead of the standard x3 dose) at night before sleep. Is there any point in doing so? Will it work?

I am not depressed at the moment but I had some issues in the past - I want to take it as a smart drug, for it's neural growth properties and because when I was on Tianeptine I handled stress better and I could sleep more easily. So I want to give a subtle long term solution with this scenario.

Anybody?
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xanadu
post Jun 30, 2006, 02:28 PM
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I may have missed something here. Is stablon illegal in the USA? I didn't realise it had been used that long in europe. I still would like to hear more research on it.
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Tone
post Jul 04, 2006, 10:34 PM
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QUOTE

No, I'm not denying your experience--If your SSRI has worked for you, great. Problem with SSRIs? Your brain eventually "realizes" that there's far too much serotonin around, much more than is being used...so it DOWN REGULATES SEROTONIN PRODUCTION!--AND THEN WHAT ARE YOU STUCK WITH?..THE NEED TO TAKE MORE AND MORE, JUST TO GET THE SAME EFFECT...AND WORSE, THE INABILITY TO QUIT,AS YOUR BODY'S ALREADY--STOPPED PRODUCING THE SEROTONIN IT SHOULD BE--AND EVEN WAS IN THE FIRST PLACE!!! YOU'RE HOOKED, BABY, THAT'S WHAT. A Pharm corp. junkie bit*h. ASK THOSE WHO'VE TAKEN PAXIL, ASK ABOUT PROZAC DOSAGE ESCALATION....THEN ASK YOURSELF AGAIN WHETHER YOU'RE really BETTER OFF--- IN THE....LONG RUN.
uth.


So? if you take a dopaminergic your dopamine receptors downregulate. if you take an opioid, your mu downregulates. if you take a noradrenalergic your noradrenaline receptors downregulate. also, i get tolerance to stablon fast, granted it also has long term benefits.

comparing stablon to SSRIs is literally like comparing SSRIs to cocaine or percocet. stablon causes pleasure ok, it makes you feel well and stimulated. SSRIs do not, otherwise youd see them being sold on the street and also patients saying they love it so much.
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Tone
post Jul 04, 2006, 10:38 PM
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QUOTE(xanadu @ Jun 30, 05:28 PM) *

I may have missed something here. Is stablon illegal in the USA? I didn't realise it had been used that long in europe. I still would like to hear more research on it.


Order it, its not illegal, why would it be illegal?? its just not a drug thats here thats all.
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kLee
post Jul 07, 2006, 06:51 AM
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QUOTE(kLee @ Jun 28, 06:22 PM) *

Got a maybe dumb question about tianeptine usage. I'm thinking of taking once per day (instead of the standard x3 dose) at night before sleep. Is there any point in doing so? Will it work?

I am not depressed at the moment but I had some issues in the past - I want to take it as a smart drug, for it's neural growth properties and because when I was on Tianeptine I handled stress better and I could sleep more easily. So I want to give a subtle long term solution with this scenario.

Anybody?


Bump!?
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Tone
post Jul 08, 2006, 10:43 AM
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Yea. why not? one is a lot lot more than none. you could take one and still get some benefit im sure. stablon is very good for your brain =)
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LifeMirage
post Jul 10, 2006, 06:11 PM
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Its one of the safest drugs for depression I've come across.
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kLee
post Jul 11, 2006, 02:18 AM
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Thanx Tone and LifeMirage!
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