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> does anyone know any supplements to help with talking to people?, something for conversational skills.
opfor101
post Dec 03, 2007, 01:14 PM
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hey guys,
these days i havent been able to talk to people i know really well.
its more of like, im there but i cant really bring up a great conversation.

does anyone know anything to help this?
i already take phenibut but doesnt help.
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Genesis.SVK
post Dec 05, 2007, 04:16 AM
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I suggest DMAE (antianxiety, verbal fluency, creativity improvement, it is very cheap, but take only 50 to 150 mg DMAE bitartat per day because more can cause opposite effect), Maral root extract (neurostimulant, shortens reaction time), Lavender (antiaxiety, relaxation, enhance concentration but dose dependent, too much cause sleepeness), Sage (antiaxiety, relaxation, enhance concentration), Mellisa officialis (antiaxiety, relaxation, enhance concentration), linden (antiaxiety, relaxation, enhance concentration)

QUOTE(opfor101 @ Dec 03, 2007, 01:14 PM) *

hey guys,
these days i havent been able to talk to people i know really well.
its more of like, im there but i cant really bring up a great conversation.

does anyone know anything to help this?
i already take phenibut but doesnt help.

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zhenka11230
post Dec 05, 2007, 08:28 AM
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QUOTE(opfor101 @ Dec 03, 2007, 04:14 PM) *

hey guys,
these days i havent been able to talk to people i know really well.
its more of like, im there but i cant really bring up a great conversation.

does anyone know anything to help this?
i already take phenibut but doesnt help.


Lol mate why not just practice conversation... Social skills are not to be found in a pill. Social skills are just like any other skill - you have to practice and get better. But worry not, there is a number of books on social skills.
I never read any so i do not know which are good.

Tip#1 is be an interesting person meaning that you cant just work out all day and expect to be able to have great conversation. You need to read and find out things all the time and then you can talk about them with your friends.

Tip#2 Memorize a few jokes or whatever, work on your sense of humor.

Tip#3 Talk.

Tip#4 Some people don't click(in my case i click only with a few who know their shit in philosophy) so dont feel bad if you cant talk to some people; it is normal. In fact one of the ways to find out if your friends are really for you is to see how easy you talk to each other.

Hope that helps. Just get that magic pill for everything out of your mind.
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Genesis.SVK
post Dec 05, 2007, 09:10 AM
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Training of conversation may help but unfotunately there is genetical limitations. One man is pretty, atractive, communicative, strong, healthy, inteligent, with perfect adaptation to environment while another is ill, awfull, with low inteligence and learning ability and weak. Nature have never been fair.

QUOTE(zhenka11230 @ Dec 05, 2007, 08:28 AM) *

QUOTE(opfor101 @ Dec 03, 2007, 04:14 PM) *

hey guys,
these days i havent been able to talk to people i know really well.
its more of like, im there but i cant really bring up a great conversation.

does anyone know anything to help this?
i already take phenibut but doesnt help.


Lol mate why not just practice conversation... Social skills are not to be found in a pill. Social skills are just like any other skill - you have to practice and get better. But worry not, there is a number of books on social skills.
I never read any so i do not know which are good.

Tip#1 is be an interesting person meaning that you cant just work out all day and expect to be able to have great conversation. You need to read and find out things all the time and then you can talk about them with your friends.

Tip#2 Memorize a few jokes or whatever, work on your sense of humor.

Tip#3 Talk.

Tip#4 Some people don't click(in my case i click only with a few who know their shit in philosophy) so dont feel bad if you cant talk to some people; it is normal. In fact one of the ways to find out if your friends are really for you is to see how easy you talk to each other.

Hope that helps. Just get that magic pill for everything out of your mind.

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zhenka11230
post Dec 05, 2007, 11:02 AM
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You cannot blame genetics on this... Genetics do impose limitations but before you hit your limitation it is going to take a looong time. It is kind of like working out... Yes steroids can increase your genetically predisposition but it is not like you cannot be diesel without it. Not to mention the fact that we are social creatures and evolved that way for ages meaning that it is hard to believe one doesn't have genetically predisposition to communicating with others.
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Flex
post Dec 05, 2007, 01:38 PM
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It is a practiced skill. The more you socialize, the better you become. If you can master the art of small talk (which is really the art of questioning) you will be successful, especially as far as girls are concerned. The fact is, most girls are ego centric, and want to talk about themselves and be assured that they are pretty, nice, and smart.

As far as real conversations go, learn new things, and encourage your friends to do the same; in this way, you can share new information, and discuss new ideas. Once the foundation (a good central question) has been laid, conversation comes natural. Once again, I cannot stress the art of questioning.
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zhenka11230
post Dec 05, 2007, 03:25 PM
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QUOTE(Flex @ Dec 05, 2007, 04:38 PM) *

It is a practiced skill. The more you socialize, the better you become. If you can master the art of small talk (which is really the art of questioning) you will be successful, especially as far as girls are concerned. The fact is, most girls are ego centric, and want to talk about themselves and be assured that they are pretty, nice, and smart.

As far as real conversations go, learn new things, and encourage your friends to do the same; in this way, you can share new information, and discuss new ideas. Once the foundation (a good central question) has been laid, conversation comes natural. Once again, I cannot stress the art of questioning.


Yes i agree with you there. Questioning is the key to small talk/meeting new people type of thing and finding out new things(become interesting person) is the key to deep conversations.
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Genesis.SVK
post Dec 06, 2007, 12:18 PM
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Sorry but I can. Life is just program. Communication ability and social skills are enormously dependent on
genetic program. If you manage your dog will talk to you in english then I take back my assertion.

QUOTE(zhenka11230 @ Dec 05, 2007, 11:02 AM) *

You cannot blame genetics on this... Genetics do impose limitations but before you hit your limitation it is going to take a looong time. It is kind of like working out... Yes steroids can increase your genetically predisposition but it is not like you cannot be diesel without it. Not to mention the fact that we are social creatures and evolved that way for ages meaning that it is hard to believe one doesn't have genetically predisposition to communicating with others.

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forgottenpresence
post Dec 08, 2007, 10:46 AM
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QUOTE(GodConsciousness @ Dec 07, 2007, 06:23 AM) *

Ironically enough, listening can be your best cure. Try to really listen and understand the other person so that you can better converse with them.

Also, I agree with other posters that reading more and developing your own interests will help your conversational skills.


Listening is definitely one of the most important things. I went through sort of the same thing when I used to smoke a lot of dope. It burnt me out so much that I lost interested in socializing and pretty much forgot how.

This created anxiety which did not help when trying to bring myself back into my old social ways.

What I really needed was confidence and mental energy.

Meditation helped with the confidence (daily morning meditation).

American ginseng helped restore my unbalanced energy levels. Throw in some royal jelly as well. American ginseng is relaxing which helps with the anxiety of trying to start and hold a conversation. It is relaxing, yet provides physical and mental energy without the anxiousness of coffee and panax ginseng. It is known to enhance verbal fluency and memory, which are important when communicating. Like GodConsciousness said, listening is very important. American ginseng will help you to enhance your listening skills, meditation will too. Listening requires concentration, meditation develops concentration (focus on the breath). Get the good american ginseng which contains a high amount of ginsenosides. Also know that it takes around 6 months for this stuff to fully kick in, so don't expect results right away. Developing this skill requires cultivation, it is not an overnight process.

What will also help to restore confidence and mental energy is avoiding heavy foods. Cut out greasy foods, try to eat heavy meats (beef, pork) at the end of the day. Eat flax seed, nuts, fish, whole grain bread/bagels, veggies and fruits. Cut out the caffeine. You don't want anything that gives anxiety. Don't eat a lot of refined suguar and foods with a lot of chemicals.

Get exercise as this pumps your brain with dopamine which will help with the confidence and energy you need.

Get a lot of sun. Sungazing is very effective.

Look into these as well -

Reishi
Gotu Kila
Ashwagandha
Brahmi
Tumeric
L-Carnitine
Alpha Lipoic Acid
CoQ10
Jiogulan
Bioperine

http://www.organicindiausa.com
http://iherb.com/

Good luck.
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Flex
post Dec 09, 2007, 05:26 PM
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I am curious to see how you all attack the art of questioning. Maybe it will help us all with our conversational skills to see what sort of questions others typically use in social settings. Lets say you are on a first date with a girl: what do you ask?
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Rick
post Dec 10, 2007, 04:18 PM
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QUOTE(Flex @ Dec 09, 2007, 05:26 PM) *
... Lets say you are on a first date with a girl: what do you ask?

What do you like to do in your spare time?
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Molitor
post Dec 10, 2007, 06:55 PM
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QUOTE(opfor101 @ Dec 03, 2007, 04:14 PM) *

hey guys,
these days i havent been able to talk to people i know really well.
its more of like, im there but i cant really bring up a great conversation.

does anyone know anything to help this?
i already take phenibut but doesnt help.


If you're having trouble talking to people you know really well, such as long-time friends and family members, and there's nothing going on in your life to otherwise explain it, you should probably seek counseling to try to nail down what's going on. Especially if the problem is sufficient that you're losing existing relationships because of it.

You should also give up all recreational drugs, especially pot. Phenibut, too.

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Orbz
post Dec 13, 2007, 04:27 PM
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QUOTE(Flex @ Dec 10, 2007, 10:26 AM) *

I am curious to see how you all attack the art of questioning. Maybe it will help us all with our conversational skills to see what sort of questions others typically use in social settings. Lets say you are on a first date with a girl: what do you ask?

In the spirit of BrainMeta sociological research, any and all suggestions (excluding ridiculous pick up lines, although if amusing enough I'd probably be masochistic enough to try them) will be used over the coming weekend by myself, to mostly random strangers, and I will report back here. Ones to be used for tonight must be in within 8 hours of this message, and ones for tomorrow night must be in by 32 hours.
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Flex
post Dec 13, 2007, 09:21 PM
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Where do you see yourself in 10 year?
If you could have anything what would it be?
What is your greatest fear?
Coffee or tea?

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LifeMirage
post Dec 15, 2007, 06:04 PM
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QUOTE(opfor101 @ Dec 03, 2007, 03:14 PM) *
hey guys,
these days i havent been able to talk to people i know really well.
its more of like, im there but i cant really bring up a great conversation.

does anyone know anything to help this?
i already take phenibut but doesnt help.


Racetams can be helpful.
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Joesus
post Dec 16, 2007, 10:10 AM
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It's really strange that the idea of mechanically projecting stimuli in order to create some kind of relative connection between two people is so wrapped up in an idea of social behavior.
Asking questions made from a list, memorizing clever things to say...I doubt any real relationship between people is maintained at that level of non feeling.

Personally I think this conversation thing is being ignored for what it really represents which is a need for a relationship with all of the connotations of a focus that is self absorbed in self doubt, self worth, fear, and no clear direction in what will take place after contact is made.

If this mechanical approach to social behavior is all that is desired, then for sex, pay for a hooker.
For mechanical conversation, go to any chat room or participate in a media such as this.
For mechanical marriage pay for sex by finding a shallow individual who responds to gifts or favors, and will want you for your gifts and favors. Or get a mail order bride if you are a man, if your a woman be a slut to your man.

Memorizing pickup lines and jokes may get someones attention but after that then what?
If you don't believe in any worth in your self then you will resort to buying attention with something you give value over your own self and personality.

On the off chance you find value in yourself then it would be wise to seek someone of common interests, and explore those interests with each other.
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Flex
post Dec 16, 2007, 02:29 PM
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You don't know if you have common interests, unless you ask seemingly trivial questions. You have to learn to ask questions that will open up possibilities for more questions, like any good interviewer. Once you find out the individuals interests, then you can pursue a real conversation, but until the preliminary conversation has taken place, you have no grounds to stand on.
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Orbz
post Dec 16, 2007, 06:51 PM
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QUOTE(Joesus @ Dec 17, 2007, 03:10 AM) *

It's really strange that the idea of mechanically projecting stimuli in order to create some kind of relative connection between two people is so wrapped up in an idea of social behavior.
Clearly not a behaviourist then?
QUOTE

Asking questions made from a list, memorizing clever things to say...I doubt any real relationship between people is maintained at that level of non feeling.

Personally I think this conversation thing is being ignored for what it really represents which is a need for a relationship with all of the connotations of a focus that is self absorbed in self doubt, self worth, fear, and no clear direction in what will take place after contact is made.


I agree. I saw the purpose of this as more of an exercise to develop scaffolding for further communication with somebody. Its like giving a talk or a speech, you don't remember everything you want to say or write it down and speak it verbatim, but you can give yourself cues to work with when you get stuck. If you're having trouble getting stuck then scaffolding can help with the self doubt and fear until you no longer need them anymore.

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Orbz
post Dec 16, 2007, 07:09 PM
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QUOTE(Flex @ Dec 14, 2007, 02:21 PM) *

Where do you see yourself in 10 year?
If you could have anything what would it be?
What is your greatest fear?
Coffee or tea?


These were tricky questions to bring up without any lead in to them except for coffee or tea question. The problem was, as Joesus pointed out, the mechanical nature of bringing them into the conversation. For example I was talking with somebody for a while and then brought up "where do you see yourself in 10 years?" I got a little bit of strange look before they ended up going "I don't know" which kind of stalled the conversation. I'd say reserve that for somebody you know quite well and are doing the whole where is your life taking you conversation.

I tried to remember things that I talked about, boy did I do a lot of talking over the weekend.

I spent a few hours with one girl talking about everything from partying, family, old relationships, sex, psychology, crazy studies I've been reading about.

At a dinner party we ended up talking about alcohol, other drugs, people's work, people's relationships, girl's hyper meta emotions.

At a party intended for merely drinking we talked about evolutionary psychology, trust, cooking, travel, relationships, drinking.

What stuck the most in mind was different attitudes that I had at the different places I was at and how people would respond. At one place I was talking to 2 girls, I talked to one as a friend in a friend type attitude (we'd known each other a while) and at the same time I took the absolute piss out of the other one (who I didn't really know), to the point where I was just about crossing the line, and she loved it. It was quite amusing.
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maximus242
post Dec 16, 2007, 07:54 PM
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QUOTE(Orbz @ Dec 16, 2007, 08:09 PM) *

QUOTE(Flex @ Dec 14, 2007, 02:21 PM) *

Where do you see yourself in 10 year?
If you could have anything what would it be?
What is your greatest fear?
Coffee or tea?


These were tricky questions to bring up without any lead in to them except for coffee or tea question. The problem was, as Joesus pointed out, the mechanical nature of bringing them into the conversation. For example I was talking with somebody for a while and then brought up "where do you see yourself in 10 years?" I got a little bit of strange look before they ended up going "I don't know" which kind of stalled the conversation. I'd say reserve that for somebody you know quite well and are doing the whole where is your life taking you conversation.

I tried to remember things that I talked about, boy did I do a lot of talking over the weekend.

I spent a few hours with one girl talking about everything from partying, family, old relationships, sex, psychology, crazy studies I've been reading about.

At a dinner party we ended up talking about alcohol, other drugs, people's work, people's relationships, girl's hyper meta emotions.

At a party intended for merely drinking we talked about evolutionary psychology, trust, cooking, travel, relationships, drinking.

What stuck the most in mind was different attitudes that I had at the different places I was at and how people would respond. At one place I was talking to 2 girls, I talked to one as a friend in a friend type attitude (we'd known each other a while) and at the same time I took the absolute piss out of the other one (who I didn't really know), to the point where I was just about crossing the line, and she loved it. It was quite amusing.


Just read the book "How to win friends and influence people". Get the oldest copy of it you can (I suggest amazon.com) because they apparently "updated" (read: screwed up) the newer editions so its not as good as the original. In other words, get the earliest edition you can find.
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Joesus
post Dec 16, 2007, 10:35 PM
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QUOTE(Flex @ Dec 16, 2007, 10:29 PM) *

You don't know if you have common interests, unless you ask seemingly trivial questions. You have to learn to ask questions that will open up possibilities for more questions, like any good interviewer. Once you find out the individuals interests, then you can pursue a real conversation, but until the preliminary conversation has taken place, you have no grounds to stand on.

No grounds to stand on? You mean you are nobody until someone says you are?
I think you have what's inside of you and if you aren't ashamed of it then you could openly discuss what's relevant to you. This will on its own merit open the door for like minded individuals who will meet you where you are at. Anything less might be considered compromise, and tho compromise may seem noble to some, if you are not able to freely be who you are it will deflate the spirit within you if you systematically hide bits and pieces of yourself to meet others where you think they want you to be.

Questions are often a part of conversation but do you do this with apprehension or out of genuine interest in the person?
How, 'bout those Jets?...... Whaddya think about quantum particles and vanilla ice cream?....
Ever pop a blister?....
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Flex
post Dec 16, 2007, 11:02 PM
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Why would I talk to someone if I weren't interested in them? Rarely do I walk up to an individual on the street and right away start talking about quantum mechanics, especially considering that I am as ignorant as the next man on the subject.

I like to start at the bottom, and work my way up. I think it is important to find common interests. Likewise it is also important to be yourself.

I believe it would be very difficult for a theoretic physics professor to have a conversation with an english professor, if neither compromised a bit on subject matter.
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Joesus
post Dec 16, 2007, 11:14 PM
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Well then, extending the reality of commonality in the process I guess it wouldn't be an issue to find subject matter to create conversation. One would simply start talking. Obviously if there is no response to conversation there wouldn't be a reason to continue.

Returning to the gist of the topic,
QUOTE

these days i havent been able to talk to people i know really well.
its more of like, im there but i cant really bring up a great conversation.

Maybe there is no commonality in those that this person knows really well, or he doesn't really know them so well.
It would seem if he did know them well then questions would be redundant, small talk would be a placebo for the lack of intimacy and it would be time to evolve and move on to something greater than the current circle of friends to seek commonality in subject interest and dynamism in relationship.
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Discordia
post Dec 17, 2007, 07:21 AM
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If you have trouble striking a conversation, just become a pot head. You will have more then enough to say then!
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maximus242
post Dec 17, 2007, 09:32 AM
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Its really simple to start up a conversation with people if you already know them. Just ask them about things they are interested in.

If your friend loves sports, then talk about sports - if they love science, then talk about science. Its pretty simple really.
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Flex
post Dec 17, 2007, 09:59 AM
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QUOTE(Discordia @ Dec 17, 2007, 07:21 AM) *

If you have trouble striking a conversation, just become a pot head. You will have more then enough to say then!


I like the way you think, except that then you will have a problem on the other end of the spectrum smile.gif
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Tone
post Mar 16, 2008, 08:13 PM
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The answer is GHB and Stablon. GHB is now a highly controlled substance and causes addiction whereas Stablon does not. The other drug/supplement things listed in this thread are not Sociablizers and will not have a sociablizing effect thats any significance.
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